Oh yeah, its like one of those ftp does not equal hour power arguments. Very strong opinions on either side.
Thanks. This highlighted some areas of improvement for me since it made me realise that Iâve never held FTP power for more than about 15 minutes!
In fact, in nearly all cases across my seasons, my longest duration at FTP is always set during a ramp test.
Probably as a result of focusing usually on shorter v02 max efforts, and also sticking strictly to the TR plan with any outdoor rides usually in Z2.
EDIT:
Scratch that, I found a TT I did last year where I held my FTP power for 28 mins. I donât do many steady state rides like that!
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Lol
donât get caught up in a vocabulary argument, Thunderpants. You understand what you have to do 100%. Quibbling over the exact definition of FTP wonât help your progress. ;-D
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I think it will. Even if you can complete your workouts, overestimating your FTP quickly leads to stagnation. Thatâs why an âextend your TTEâ focus is often very effective - it requires training at at or slightly below true FTP, rather than above.
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I have a low (for my size) ftp - Last time I tested it came in about 215.
I set it to 220 as I thought Iâm just shit with tests
I focus on endurance and HR:Pw rather than just on raising my FTP
My best 1hr power came on a virtual climb of the Stilvio where I managed 216 watts for the climb.
This was a low cadence grind and I would have not been able to get my fat arse up it at any less 
It still took me almost 2hrs to get to the top
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Yes itâs an estimate. Figure out what gives you a better estimate. What works for me may not work well at estimating for you. And itâs widely accepted that FTP can be held from 35-70 minutes, so how long you can hold it isnât strictly 1 hour.
The only point I try to make clear is that ramp tests estimate 5-min power at vo2max (max aerobic capacity). And your FTP as % of vo2max can change due to training. So just keep that in mind if a ramp test gives strange results.
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And thatâs all I really care about. The actual number is meaningless to me. Or how âaccurateâ it is by using whatever âbestâ testing protocol there is. The ramp test has given me good numbers to train with and Iâm seeing progress by using that number. The ramp test FTP is actually a good bit lower than both Xert and Intervals.icu. And it gives me good numbers to train with.
Theyâve said on the podcast many times that FTP and one hour power may not match for most people. Thatâs why one of my goals this winter is to extend TTE. I donât really feel like arguing semantics. Just thought it was an interesting topic to see what otherâs training/power durations were.
Your FTP isnât what the ramp test says it is either.
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You may at first, but long term you will make more progress if you set it to 285-290 watts.
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@old_but_not_dead_yet I appreciate your thoughts on this matter! Herr Kapitan has it exactly correct when he observes that the work rate he can hold for 1hr << 75% of MAP: work harder at holding a constant work rate for the largest portion of an hour.
His understanding of the situation is perfect. Quibbling over exactly what is FTP will not help even a little. Further, if Thunderpants is consistent at working at his work I judge he is very likely to have a lot of success. Itâs gonna be a lot of fun for him.
Hopefully a year from now weâll be in another thread arguing about what exactly VO2max is while CaptainThunderpants is deciding his hour TTE has hit a lid & he needs to do a VO2 block. ;-D
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Thank you for your valuable insight
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TR workouts are based on 75% of MAP. Thatâs the end of it.
Youâve been around enough to see many, many riders that canât hold 75% of MAP for an hour. The solution is exactly what @CaptainThunderpants supposes it is. 
Iâm just saying this is kinda an open-and-shut case. Letâs not confuse the matter by quibbling over semantics. Here we have a rider who has identified an issue and decided on a good way to resolve it. Way to go, rider!
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Well I can see the party has been crashed by negative nelly (who remains hidden to me). I think the addage âperfection is the enemy of goodâ applies here, and we need to keep in mind folks here are likely in the 35+ age bracket and that close enough is good enough for FTP/VO2/whatever definition you want to parse and over analyze into oblivion.
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Weâll see. Iâve had consistent progress and improvement of every power duration using the ramp test and Base/Build/Specialty for 2 years now so Iâm happy with it, and an over 80W bump in the last year alone. So as far as I see it, if it ainât broke, no need to fix it. Could I have had a bigger increase using a different protocol? Maybe. But Iâm not much for speculation. This works for me. And if/when I plateau using it, Iâll change it up. All I really care about is getting a good number to get effective workouts, and the ramp test does that for me.
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I always advice to name the FTP with the method of determining it (e.g. FTP20 = 250W, so holding 250/0.95, or 263 Watts, for 20minutes). There can be a lot of deviation between your determined FTP and your actual 1HP. A rider who is good at shorter efforts and good at recovering quickly from them (me) will likely yield a better FTP from an 8 minute Test (FTP8), while a rider who is bad at pacing, will likely have the best results from a 30 second Ramp Test. Nevertheless, however you determine it, your actual lactate threshold is still the same, and can only be determined exactly when actually measuring blood lactate levels. This of course isnât necessary for most amateurs, but just goes to show that with FTP tests yielding a wide range of results, they can never accurately give you a 1HP.
For me, the biggest means of improvement when holding âmy FTPâ for longer, was becoming more mentally tough and finding ways of staying motivated. I didnât have the issue of being completely fried, but rather not being able (mentally) to endure the pain in the legs for longer. With long, disgusting threshold intervals, I have become pretty used to it, which helps me push power for much longer (97% of my most recent 20 minute power (so the power I held for the 20
Minute test, not the FTP) test for 38 minutes).
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Exactly my feeling. Iâd rather not kill myself with trying to find the absolute best protocol to test with to give me the absolute most accurate FTP if the ramp test gives me a great estimate to base my workouts on. It takes out all of the hassle. It works.
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Except, of course, for the fact that such a perspective merely perpetuates the problem. Identifying the underlying issue - overestimation of FTP - results in a universal solution.
So do a ramp test and use 72% instead of 75%, as first suggested by Ric Stern 20 years ago. Boom, problem solved.
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Youâre welcome.