It is like anything really as prices will always go up. Some people have been a TR user for 5+ or more years now and it is great to reward early adopters.
I remember Zwift raising their prices a little over a year ago and they will keep moving up and by year end I suspect. The way it stands now TR is $60 more than Zwift paying monthly for the year and basically same if you pay yearly. Zwift does not give a discount for paying a year up front. Fwiw I use both for different reasons.
It isā¦ Op was complaining about better pricing for older customer. I just point out how cellphone service providers give new customer preferred treatment over established customers, and thatās not cool.
If you still not happy with the analogy I can refer you to the fact that cable and internet companies give new customers better pricing for 12 to 24 months then they jack the pricesā¦
So what tr is doing is the opposite of most companiesā¦ And for that I am pleased ā¦
Hop in your time machine and go back several years and you can sign up cheaper. Keep in mind you will have to pay the accumulated total cost of the service for all those years from then up to now tooā¦
I just purchased a stem for my BMC slr01 for $200. No, Iām not concerned with the price of Trainerroad, although Iām grandfathered in at $99 annually. Iād pay twice that if needed.
Itās not really a question of fair or not fair. Itās a question of perceived value.
There are also a lot more features now. Earlier customers paid less and received less of a product. Now the product is bigger, requiring a bigger team and whatnot.
I think the model TR uses is fairly common in subscription services in the United States. Iām curious where people are from that this is uncommon? I can definitely imagine it giving a bad impression if this is a totally unheard of practice where youāre from.
I think grandfathered pricing is/was a mistake. For the reason you indicate above, and also because it leaves $ on the table, and as a result, forces you to raise price higher than it would otherwise be for new users, thereby pressuring growth.
I donāt agree that grandfathered pricing is the best way or necessary to retain loyal customers. If you offer a product that customers value, and drive ongoing innovation of valuable features, that earns you the right to raise prices - and if youāre driving the right feature innovation, customers will stick with the product.
I think the current TR product is worth more than grandfathered pricing of $99 due to the various features that have been added, and the upcoming + future innovation of adaptive training.
If I was in Nateās shoes Iād be looking for the right opportunity to harmonize prices across all users. The full launch of adaptive training may be the right time.
I never understand why what other people pay has any impact on a personās decision. Are you happy to pay your price? If yes then great. If no then fair enough. Whether others pay more or less has no effect on you does it.
Then again maybe Iām weird but Iām same with salary. We had big pay review at work recently and everyone thought I as weird because I didnāt care less if people doing similar role was paid more or less than me- as long as Iām happy with the salary Iām paid for work I do then couldnāt care less if others are paid more/less than me!
I think what people sometimes forget is that the strategy is to keep people from jumping on and off the platformā¦ie subscribe for winter months, drop in the summer. To run a software company and to develop new features and function, you need stable and predictable cash flow. Keeping members on an annual plan with an incentive to keep paying is smart business. Even if I had a medical issue and could not ride for 6 month or a year, I would keep my annual subscription to keep my price grandfathered.
As Iāve said on several occasions, I will cancel TR when i know 100% I will never ride a bike again. Otherwise, TR is going to get my $99/year until I go into long term care or hospice. Which I hope is a long way away.
People complain about others paying less right up until the moment the price goes up and they now pay less than the next round of new users.
Itās a nice perk. A nice thank you. A nice way to guarantee annual revenue. I went about a year where I barely used TR. I was mostly focused on Xert. However, I kept my subscription. I was just about to cancel it for 2021 and TR announced Adaptive Training, which was enough for me to continue for another year. Without the grandfathered pricing, I probably would have left. Nate mentioned pricing AT as an add-on and if that had happened, I definitely would have left.
Zwift only offers monthly subscriptions and it bores me quickly. I occasionally join for a month or two, enjoy it, and then get bored with it and leave. Iāve done this many times, but Iāve kept TR for an extra 2 years now simply due to the grandfathered annual pricing and the possibility AT can beat Xert.
Yea from a business perspective the more or less guaranteed cash flow is definitely a positive, and yes someone might still cancel, but they are less likely to cancel because if they join again they join at a higher price, AND even if they do cancel, youāve already collected the fee for the year, not just the month.
Also the longer youāre an active member, the more referrals you get as you ride, and the more people you bring in (at the current rate), and the more you drive growth. If TR raised prices for everyone, not everyone would leave, but some would, as would their potential referral business, and their opinion of TR would surely change as a result.
Maybe the gains of raising prices for all could outweigh the attrition increase that would follow, maybe not, but Iām certainly not mad about anyone who pays less than me because theyāve been here longer, and new members shouldnāt feel the same about me either, after all itās all the OGs that have been creating piles of data for years that are going to drive the ML process forward.
I believe there are people paying $50.00 a year lol. People that signed up 10 years agoā¦ I am double that. Do I feel bad about itā¦ Of course I do. If I signed up 6 years earlier I would be some much faster!!! I would also be healthier. But if anyone can figure out how I can go back and get that extra 6-7 years back Ill pay them and I will keep my grandfathered higher rate. Im not worried about that $50.00 a year for x year.
For people that are peaved that they may have to lock in at a higher rate think of all that money you have saved over the last 10 years! @Nate_Pearson has done a huge solid here for Tr Users. Iām sorry people cant lock in at previous prices. But then people that lock in now may be saying the exact same thing to new people in 5 years.
This is just an another excellent example of the principles Nate runs the company under.
I just wish they would create family plans or something. For the amount my kid or wife would use it, it just does not make sense.
There is perhaps a bit of a life lesson in all this. Throughout my life, I have noticed that there are 2 types of people. Person A looks at others that might be getting something that they are not receiving and focuses on that. Person B looks at the things they have in life and focuses on those things with complete gratitude. Person B has contentment no matter their life circumstances. Person A is not content as no matter who you are in life, there will always be someone else receiving something you are not.
I agree with your idea for a family subscription, but I suspect that if it was introduced I would probably lose the benefit of my grandfathered subscription.
I guess if they offered pricing for a family at the current individual pricing Iād be happy to to go for that.
First off, Iām one of those on a very grandfathered price (beta user starting in 2011, subscriber since 2013) so factor that in or not as you wish.
What TR is doing with grandfathered pricing is no different than what a lot of businesses (Iām only speaking from the perspective of the US, YMMV):
Cellphone companies have grandfathered plans with unlimited data at lower monthly rates than available for subscribers today
Hotel companies provide perks (room upgrades, early check-in / late check-out, free rooms, access to club rooms with food / drinks, etc.) to their most frequent guests
Airlines gives you permanent status when you hit a certain number of miles (e.g., for United, you get lifetime Premier Gold status when you hit 1,000,000 miles)
So what TR is doing is no different than what lots of industries do: it is rewarding its most loyal customers (e.g., you have to stay on an annual plan, not cancel, not go on hiatus, etc.) with a perk. Is this fair? That is a value judgement. There isnāt a right or wrong answer. TR made a decision that grandfathering annual subscription pricing was the right decision.
At least for me, itās been a great deal. Even without this, I would have remained on an annual subscription because with my work schedule, I use TR 2 - 5 times a week, every week of the year. Right now my average usage since I started using TR back in 2011 is just under 3 rides per week for every week for the last 10 years (1391 rides)
When I bought a smart trainer to replace my old Tacx a few years ago, I tested a number of apps and evaluated each at their value vs price vs my needs. At no point did what others were paying, could have paid or whatever come into the equation. Itās irrelevant for me. I can have service A, B or C, at prices X, Y or Z.
Iām hoping that as TR adds more features and eventually does raise prices for everyone that they keep in mind that some features are provided to grow the subscriber base, but do not make it more valuable to the general user. In particular I am thinking about run/swim related features. I can understand that those will make TR much better for people who run and swim, however they add zero value for those of us that donāt. Add support for rowing? Great for rowers, not those that donāt. I donāt have anything against adding features like that, but I donāt want to pay for features that donāt apply to me at all.
I afsked the question because I live in Denmark, and we do not use such pricing in b to c business. Microsoft charge the same amount to New and Old customers in Denmark. We also pay the same price to the gym etc. I Think that in Europe you can only get New customers for a period of time with that pricing. You can find a lot of articles on the web saying do not use that pricing If you want to grow your business fast.
Therefore I was surprised, when i learned what TR does.
I thought TR was a big expanding US company which also saw EU as their market, but have learned it is not that huge and is owned by the CEO. And of course in such Company it is up to the CEO to decide the pricing.
But I simply do not understand If there will be Old free riders having the advantage of a the New program adaptive training at a low price instead of all paying e.g. 150 $ Per year.
Itās not unusual even in Europe. You charge less to initial customers as you are developing the product. Then once the product matures you raise the price to normal levels. It is a kind of crowd-funding without a third party mediating like Kickstarter or equivalent.
For those who think this policy is wrong, unfair, etc. will you explain your thinking? Iām genuinely curious if this is more a cultural issue, personal view of how businesses should treat their customers, or something else entirely.