Build phase now too easy?

It’s probably how it went. And i’m quite certain i don’t represent “normal” as well as others.

AT currently only works with Plan Builder. :ok_hand:

Ok; so if i want to use AT but want to start from build phase, i should add the whole year then edit it? What a pain :grimacing:
If it’s the only way, good thing it’s weekend.

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Yes, I haven’t done it, but I think you could just put whatever race date way, way in the future. It might just give you multi base-build, or you just redo it when you get to the end you want to.

If you want to start at build phase but plan builder starts you with base, just backdate the start by 12 weeks.

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I started a whole thread on exactly this. Bottom line, AT led to pretty much a wasted summer of training for me. The plan was not intense enough at the start and it took to long to get up to the right level.

I was training for a trip to the Alps which didn’t happen due to C-19 and I’m glad it didn’t because I felt under prepared.

It will come right eventually, but you’ll have to wait a while for AT to get to know you, but in the meantime it’s not actually that great.

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See this is what I don’t get. If you think it’s too easy then MAKE it harder. It can’t read your brain, only the watts you put down. That simple. How is it that an old static plan is “better” than one that changes.

Ok so you might be manually changing the workouts in the beginning. That immediately puts you up progressions, and allows you to progress higher in you phase. Simple as that. No more worry if your ftp is over or under measured and you simply keep working thru progressions.

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I think it’s important to note that with Adaptive Training, the workouts you end up executing will almost certainly NOT be the ones in the default 6 week plan. That’s the whole point of Adaptive.

As you go through the initial workouts in the plan, finish them comfortably and rate them easy, the plan will present you with a harder workout (look at the progression leves) in that category the next week. You can accelerate this process a bit by using the Alternates feature to select a workout in the Stretch category.

Your post notes you “gave a look” at the plans, so of course you see the default plan. Until you actually execute a workout, and then Accept the recommended adaptations, the plan won’t change.

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I don’t find TR workouts to be “easy”. In fact, I find it exhausting. But maybe things has changed drastically since Prev I was using it like 1+ years ago.

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It has changed dramatically with the roll out of Adaptive Training (AT). As folk note above the plans do start out a little easy but if you are pushing yourself AT soon ramps them up.

The key issue is that if not using plan builder then AT wasn’t active anyway so use plan builder then will know if AT works for you or not.

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Of course, you can make the workouts harder, but that’s not a plan is it. TR reset the plans to make them easier for new subscribers to start with, but that impacted experienced subscribers who could handle more intensity/volume. The point is it takes a while for your levels to get up to where they should be, so as an experienced user loses out until they, or AT, find their level. For some that’s not acceptable.

I agree with the PLs although some do seem a bit strange. But the change to the plans, plus the intro of AT made the experience for me this year very frustrating and I definitely didn’t achieve the fitness I’d hoped for despite setting myself up for success through consistency, good diet, sleep etc.

I’m taking a different approach next cycle and will largely ignore the recommendations to take ownership of my own training, so let’s see what happens.

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As others have mentioned AT currently requires Plan Builder generated plans to work, you can’t just pick a plan and add it to your calendar. You also need to turn AT on via your profile settings.

It’s a pity that TR didn’t keep the old plans available for self-selection and let PB just use the new ones as a basis for AT. As it is now it forces you onto the new plans regardless of whether you are using AT.

There are a number of (very big) threads on Plan Builder and AT so you should be able to find what info you want in there if you dig long enough, the tip about back-dating the start of your plan to skip Base for example. You don’t get adaptations after every workout, that’s not the point, but if you show improvement or struggle in one area then AT will adjust things. I’ve had zero, two and over a dozen workouts swapped out following workouts.

I found AT a bit frustrating to begin with (which is why it was closed beta) but it’s working much better now, I’ve been doing all my workouts outdoors and it’s given me adaptations. Are they “optimal”? I’ve no idea: I’ve not seen the backward progressions that others have reported; the progression rate hasn’t been fast but I’ve not felt burnt out. That’s something that was mentioned on either the original podcast about AT or one shortly after: the internal testers thought the training stress was too low but they were comparing it to the TSS of the older plans and AT was working out how each of them coped before it ramped things up.

Also remember that we tend to fixate on FTP as a “target” to improve but you can improve elsewhere without your FTP changing. It’s the same with Progression Levels: they are just a snapshot of where AT thinks you are at the present time. Change your FTP and those levels will change to reflect that. So don’t chase PL improvements for the sake of it.

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Just use Adaptive Training. At the start of the plan, if the workouts look too easy then pick a suggested alternate workout that is “Stretch” or “Breakthrough” and the plan will adjust from then on, based on your completion success and survey responses. At any point, you can pick an alternate workout based on your current feel or mood, AT is very flexible. I like it a lot.

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Just to make sure i got this part right: in order to do that, at this point, you need a Garmin and a power meter, right?

Yes. Having said that, there is a power discrepancy between power meter and trainer power. I did outdoor workouts a week ago, picked alternates harder than suggested, completed the workouts successfully, then I was hammered by the next AT threshold workout suggestion (University). Mixing outdoor and indoor workouts in the plan could be tricky.

Ok; a follow-up after adding a plan to my calendar with AT: the process is quite convoluted, but once i got the start date to the right week in the past, the workouts were added correctly. I had to delete the remaining ones i already had. And for next week (last hard week for the uild phase) it already swapped the standard workouts to others that look much more in line with what i’d expect.
So, at this point it looks ok for my needs!
And before many of you say ‘I told you!’, or that it was my fault for not using AT already: i do stand by my original criticism. I’m a longtime user, the standard plans got worse for my use and i had to fix things after asking here and in the chat and by using a beta feature nonetheless.
All in all, if they keep refining it and enable all outside workouts with it, i’ll stick around for longer.
And indeed thank you all for the useful information!

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This. Just my n=1 experience, but I sandbagged on my ftp a little, did my first threshold workout and marked it „hard“, got adaptations, the workouts became „very hard“.
The workouts feel just right by now and I m happy and have a calm mind that they’ll probably get easier when I mark a workout „all out“ that’s not supposed to be all out.
Maybe I m just lucky, but it works like a charm for me.

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Garmin, pretty sure. Power meter, not necessarily - I did quite a few workouts on my MTB which doesn’t have a power meter but I used an HRM and the system worked out effort from that.

The setting of the start of a plan in the past is a bit of a hack TBH. Like a lot of things, PB assumes a clean slate. Like I said above, I think the existing plans should have remained in place until AT was out of beta and the default setup.

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You can use outside workouts with a Wahoo unit. Only thing is that they will always be marked as a succes for now. So if you did fail, you’ll have to be real honest with yourself and perhaps tone down the next workout of that type.

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