I certainly do understand it, but do not accept it. As simple as it is: all of such arguments do not cover up for idiocy of anybody who is using such substances especially as an amateur.
The other side of the crazy coin is all the amateur athletes who take the sport too seriously.
7 Likes
I think that amateurs who dope probably take it way too seriously… or is that what you mean?
2 Likes
After reading this thread I have two conclusions for now:
- The opinions on this forum seem to lean very much pro-doping… which is… concerning
- people here don´t seem to be aware that drugs have side-effects… which is… also concerning
5 Likes
Some of them definitely do. But I think most people who dope in amateur sports are doping to just feel younger in life but as a consequence they also do better in their hobby sports.
I don’t really care if I’m top 10% of my AG or top of it or mid pack. What does it really mean? We are all doing this for health and fun. What will winning my AG or even amateur national champ even mean? I have no issues people doing whatever they feel they want to do.
3 Likes
Maybe it is one consequence of a culture which promotes winning to be the ultimate, even only goal… where being 2nd is not regarded as good enough… that is not the way I was brought up.
2 Likes
I understand what you’re saying. Guess it lays deeper and just has to do with the way how people look at aging in general.
For me personally the aim is to not want to feel younger because, hopefully, a whole life of healthy exercise and nutrition will ensure that quality of life is high. And that in itself will let you be at peace no matter the age.
I’d guess that for some, it’s more about the thrill of getting away with it. Like celebrities who shoplift.
1 Like
I don’t get the impression people are pro-doping here. Only realistic that there is opportunity and motivation for amateur and professional athletes alike. Understanding peoples motivations for taking PEDs is very different from supporting or condoning them.
There is also plenty of back and forth on risk/reward which isn’t about the specific side effects of abusing PEDs, is about balancing those side effects against the perceived payoff / reward. I get the impression that most people here perceive the risk / reward balance to be unfavorable for most people.
8 Likes
Turning 40 this year and I feel this. My solution was to stop drinking, clean up my diet, get better sleep, etc. Those lifestyle changes made me feel 10 years younger - I can easily see how someone would swallow/inject/rub something to get that same feeling.
Edit for clarity: I am highly empathetic but am in no way condoning enhancing ones performance though artificial means.
5 Likes
How do you feel about supplements that aren’t on the WADA ban list? Seems to me if an aging person is taking supplements (whether prescription or not) that’s between them and their doctor. In competition is trickier obviously, but if one isn’t racing for a podium who cares. I think there’s a lot of fundamental attribution error going around this thread.
- a masters age athlete who is not doping but would consider it
1 Like
I wonder what would happen if organizers made a separate category for dopers to compete against each other legally? That’s an experiment that I would watch 
1 Like
When people toe the line for a USAC or UCI sanctioned race are they not agreeing to compete under a set of commonly understood rules? Even if stupid and arbitrary they are available to read before competition and by racing each person is agreeing to be bound by those rules.
I could be DQed for tossing a waterbottle in the hedges (regardless of whether I think it is a silly rule or not and regardless of if I have a chance to be on the podium or not) or cussing someone out in an un-sportsperson like way and should know ahead of time that I cannot do so. Why should someone else be able to use prohibited substances in violation of those commonly agreed to rules just because they probably won’t podium?
As far as use of non-prohibited ‘supplements’ I think it really depends on what is included under that definition. If you’re talking protein powder, caffeine, creatine, etc., those don’t violate the agreed rules, I don’t have an issue with that. If you’re talking designer drugs that haven’t made onto the prohibited list yet or repurposing say, livestock medications, I would have a problem with those but it really depends on the definition you’re using for ‘supplements’.
2 Likes
I’m pretty sure that was the pro peleton in the 90s and early 2000s. That is basically the onset of EPO use until the biological passport kicked in.
Thats why 21 year old pros were having heart attacks in the middle of the night because their blood was too thick and hearts couldn’t pump anymore. Thats why there was an unusually high number of pros compared to the general population with weird tumors and cancers that do not normally affect young men (testicular cancer, contador’s brain tumor, etc.).
Nah, I’m talking about amateur racing. I want doper categories in amateur racing.
If it was competition under a commonly accepted set of rules that people were not violating, sure, whatever. I probably would not watch knowing my entertainment would be at the likely expense of other people’s long term health. I doubt it could be done that ensures the safety of participants and minimizes the human cost.
To me, big reasons for PED restrictions are the short and long term health impacts. How many people know that long term abuse of GH can cause insulin resistance and diabetes (6-7 of the substances from the example are GH / GH secretagogues / artificially produced GH)? How many people know the negative health impacts of low estrogen levels in men (neural health, sex drive, etc.)? If my understanding is correct, taking nandrolone and anastrozole (reduces aromatization of testosterone to estrogen) without a test base would crush your testosterone production and estrogen levels and could get real bad depending on long that went on for.
I prefer to not meddle in other people’s decisions. So exclude the minors (of course) but otherwise if you are an adult you are free to kill yourself slowly with drugs or instantly on a Red Bull course. Kind of the way society has approached smoking.
2 Likes
Interesting article. Not at all surprised.
Take the blinkers off and most people would’ve seen this going on around them from 16 onwards.
Read that a couple of years ago, but couldn’t remember what it was called, thanks for digging it out. Pretty sure people do all of that without realising or at least admitting to themselves that they are doping. Especially when they are not competitive in any races. Once they are near the top of their category, they might think about it more carefully, but I’d guess a lot of amateurs doping don’t do it to win.
To be clear, i’m not juding somebody who would consider this. You’re absolutely right when you say that it’s up to that person. Just giving my thoughts on what my stance is towards ‘‘supplementing’’ with those kind of products for my own body. @Craig_G put it very well:
I’m also departing from the premise that the person is healthy and that there’s no need for supplementation.
1 Like