Off topic slightly but how would i go about structuring a SST training plan? any good resources out there? I am interested.
There is a massive sst thread on here if you search. Too lazy to find it myself.
Thanks, found some good stuff.
Thanks! 
. Sadly, the guy was talking about the “debunked” nutritional manipulations. I did hear Steve Neal regurgitate this same stuff.
Yes, I guess since I had ignored most of those dietary recommendations before I hadn’t committed it to memory.
In my own personal racing results though, I did experience most of the other negative effects he proposed from overly relying on glycolytic energy production. Ssb2 got me some great ftp gains, and lots of new strava prs, but the overemphasis on a puncheur power profile became a liability. I had to race much further away from my new ftp than before.
I had been thinking about zone 3, specifically tempo, before I saw this thread.
As a recreational rider tapping out a tempo and riding faster than zone 2 is an objective, so why wouldn’t training in zone 3, ie spending more time in the target zone, be beneficial?
In general, not slowing down with distance and fatigue affects average speed more than time at threshold, so training to spend more time in zone ought to be good?
We are not all racers and some of us oldies just want a good plan through winter to be ready to go ride a decent pace for a decent distance come better weather. With age recovery gets more difficult. Zone 3 tempo and SS seems about right, enables volume at reasonable effort without compromising recovery.
Too much Z3 interferes with your ability to recover. You can no longer do high quality high intensity sessions. Z3 is hard enough to generate substantial fatigue, without generating a strong aerobic or anaerobic adaption signals.
Training is about generating the strongest adaption signals, whilst also being able to recover. The argument and evidence is that lots of Z3 does not generate the strongest signals. Thus it is cost vs. benefit question. Some Z3 is fine, but overdo it, and you will be slower come the Spring than an appropriate mix of hard and easy.
It can be, hence sweet spot plans and the tempo plans I mentioned above.
The key is to treat a tempo session like a high intensity session (so maybe only 1-2 per week) and keep the easy days easy (as they say).
Reving it up a notch into low tempo constantly won’t move the needle IMO. Higher tempo intervals, up to sweet spot, can help the rider increase training load quite a bit which will ultimately move the needle.
Maybe Inigo San Milan devotees would advocate those longer low tempo intervals on longer rides. That can work too. There are many ways to skin the cat. You still have to treat it as one of your intensity days within your plan.
Do people consider SweetSpot zone 3? What percentages of FTP would you call zone 3?
I feel like all these changes, “zone 3 is dead” “Do lots of zone 2” “Zone 3 is back!” “Zone 2 is useless” partly stems from different sources calling different intensities zone 2 or 3 or 4. Like ISM zone 2 is somebody else’s zone 3. That’s why I hate all this talk about zones without actual intensities given. Is it zone 3 out of 3? Out of 7? Out of 10?
People over complicate it. You’ll get 99% there if you…
- Do an endurance ride.
- Ride some hills if you got em.
- Do a couple hard days a week and don’t over-do it.
- Ride the other days “chill” and by feel.
Impossible! Simple can’t be effective. 
I like to express intensity of a bike ride as a number in a Power Zone range as continuous number rather just a Zone. For instance my Zone 2 as a 79 year old rider is 118 to160. The range is 42. My. Zone 3 is 161 to 192 the range is 31. So I use Excel to compute what i call as a Net Zone Indicator, NZI. So for an example a ride that averages 170 watts would be NZI= 3.3 and a ride that average 140 would be NZI=2.5. This is gives me a better feeling about whether I am in Zone 2 or 3. If I average 185 watts NZI = 3.8, I might as well be in Zone 4. The NZI gives more resolution.
Zone 3 should not interfere with recovery unless you are close to Zone 4. Zone 4 will definitely interfere so I limit them to 2 per week. If Zone 3 interferes with recovery you should retake your FTP.
Some would say that you burned more kilojoules for no measurable fitness gain over zone 2 and thus the extra energy expenditure does impact your recovery.
And some people recovery faster than others so one’s mileage may vary.
Are you saying that there’s no (measurable) fitness gain from putting forth more effort?
Yes, in well trained cyclists the adaptations from endurance training come from time in the saddle and the volume of muscle contractions (calcium channel stimulation). Going a little bit harder doesn’t provide any extra benefit. This is why some coaches prescribe very slow endurance miles (as low as 50% of FTP) instead of the usual 65% - 50% is not junk miles IMO.
Now, maybe if you ride 3 hours per week then it’s a different equation and since you have four days per week of recovery, burning a few more kjs is not going to matter.
I think it does make a difference in metabolic efficiency..
Generally speaking, well-trained athletes also have much higher thresholds, and their LT1 is at a higher percentage of it than ours. This makes even Z2 really taxing for them and isn’t simply the default for extra mileage like it is for so many of us.
There are a lot of elite athletes who are using their Z1 like we use our Z2, and it can make up 80 or even 90% of their total volume, depending on what part of their training they’re in and how much they’re training.
For lower-volume, less elite riders, Z3 can be really beneficial, assuming that your training volume is restricted by time and not adaptation capabilities.
No more VO2 or Threshold workouts!!! Zone 1 all day baby.
Mattias Reck talked about this (metabolic stress) in a recent Roadman interview. 50% of an FTP of >400 watts is a lot of work, even for a pro like Mads Pederssen. Us mortals can often get away with an occasional drift into z3 without to much additional fatigue. Mattias made some good points in that interview.
There’s a place for all zones. The balance just depends on the athlete, their fitness, and the specificity of their training. There are a lot of athletes doing long Z3 workouts, but that counts as hard work, not easy.