This is a screen shot from the Training and Racing with a Power Meter, what Kurt said sounds good too. I’m not a coach but a “self coach” and try to bookmark training advice from books like these. Read the bottom note part first….
Oh that’s very interesting…and pretty much in line with what Kurt was saying…dropping 30 watts or so really isnt a big deal for a 3 minute effort…
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Probably a little bit of overthinking IMO. But it’s reasonable. For the most part with VO2max training, you just kinda know when you’re done for the day. You’re dreading the next interval but it doesn’t turn around with recovery. And usually if you’re struggling to stay above threshold for a long period of the interval, you’re probably cooked.
For anaerobic efforts like 1 min efforts or short/short repeats, 10-15% changes in average interval power are a good indicator IMO.
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Sounds like you got the desired effect!
Sometims at the end of my 4th/5th on I am barely at threshold towards the end of the interval - but my heart rate is high. Doesn’t tend to matter
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i started a vo2 block today, went with 6x3min, I’m only using zwift now, so I just the trainer difficulty to like 10ish% used my garmin to record laps
happy with the outcome, i could have gone harder, my HR was 172-174 by the end of these and it can get near 180, so something to work on for the next.
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Did a good volume plus threshold block in June, so it is time for vo2.
I was wondering if anyone has experimented with structures that do not conform to calender weeks?
I was thinking about something like this:
- Vo2, total 2h
- Vo2 + easy endurance, total 4-5h
- Rest
- 1h easy spin
- 1h easy spin
Aim to do 8-10 sessions then recover then specific stuff. Races in late august.
The main reason for this kind of structure is to maximize family holiday time. The second reason is to hold on to a long ride and have several days to recover from the efforts.
Thoughts?
Could work. Just have to be mindful of fatigue. I have programmed several non-standard blocks and usually manage them by microblock.
So that might be two or three stacked VO2 workouts and then 2 or 3 easy days. How the next micro block looks depends on how things are going. Maybe it’s two easy days before the next sets. Maybe it’s 3. Maybe it’s time to end the block after two weeks.
I wouldn’t try to do more than two consecutive days of VO2 (but doing 3 workouts in 2 days is possible if the workouts are structured properly), and I wouldn’t try to force that long ride into every single block. Do it if you feel like it and try to maintain your normal volume otherwise. That might look like more 1-2 hr rides instead of one 4-5hr ride.
The point of the block is to maximize VO2 work while minimizing the change in volume. You could do three weeks of this and do one 4-5 hour ride and you’d be fine.
But the real question I have is why are you doing the block? I normally like to have some FTP work after VO2 since we are looking to maximize the aerobic gains. If you’re doing this for race specific performance purposes, you might be better off focusing on 3-5 min power (rather than VO2max). In my mind, those are two distinct things.
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These blocks are just borrowing from the future. It mostly helps coaches to justify fees.
What if there is no future?
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Thanks Kurt,
I chose the 2 days on, 3 off template with fatigue monitoring in mind. Could have been 2-2, but better err on the conservative side. Including the long rides was to maintain volume near what I did in June, but perhaps it would be a good idea to cut some of them out depending on how things feel. I was also expecting to pull the plug at 2-3wks.
Indeed, ideally I would like to do a threshold block afterwards and would probably have the time for it after recovering, too. However, the realistic expectation is to catch an upper respiratory infection soon after schools and kindergartens start in early august (regardless of the training load). It is what it is. Anticipating this may appear a bit defeatist, but I was kinda thinking to take this into account and not plan a threshold block around that time, but accept this is an uncertain period and the skip over to race prep. But perhaps a plausible compromise might be to just take it one day at a time with FTP work and see how it goes. As shorter efforts are a relative strength to me, perhaps I would not even need much of that afterwards. So this could also favour the threshold focus.
Several reasons for thinking about blocking it. Given my usual life constraints, volume, threshold and non-blocked vo2 seem to take me about where I am at the moment but not further. So perhaps properly focusing on vo2 could bump the aerobic parts of the power curve up. Also, in the past I have found myself lacking when the going gets repeatedly hard during road races. Whether this would be better fixed by focusing on 3-5min power, I don’t really know, but I think repeatability is more of a problem than power output around those durations. So I thought a higher aerobic ceiling as such could help here (even if I could not get the ideal FTP follow-up block in).
Finally, I am also curious.
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Not really, I feel you. Same thing happens around here a lot. I’ll be rolling along well, then my kids come home with some weird thing that I inevitably get and I’m derailed. If I can just stay healthy enough to be consistent most of the year, I feel pretty good about things.
That said, I wouldn’t periodize around planning on getting sick. Do what makes the most sense for your race/training schedule, and then adjust as needed.
The reasoning for doing VO2 vs more performance-focus for your races is sound in my opinion. Go race with what you have. That extra 5% of anaerobic power is less valuable in most racing than better developed aerobic capacity and recoverability. In the case of a training parent who gets sick a lot (my personal life!), anaerobic training is usually what I’m most willing to sacrifice.
Awfully cynical viewpoint here, and one I summarily disagree with. Nothing I do in coaching is to justify fees because I don’t coach to send my kids to college. I coach because I love coaching and helping people improve. I just want to be fairly compensated for spending my time. If you think I’m getting rich off of coaching cycling, I can assure you I am not. 
And anyway I have basically told people exactly how I design and execute these blocks, cited source coaching material that’s freely available on the internet, and I’m doing it all on a free forum, so I guess I’m just doing it wrong.
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Even with you posting your knowledge of I wanted to go all in, I would prob still hire a coach. Something about someone holding us accountable
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I think for me, and the reason I would personally hire a coach…is to have a resource to sort of frame known and researched training concepts around what I am experiencing. Meaning…what should this workout feel like? I feel “X” level of fatigue at X point in the training plan…is this normal? Do I need to adjust?
Everything else seems more or accessible for free frankly if one is willing to do a bit of reading. The knowing when to hit the gas and when to hit the brakes on training is something I’ve only now, after years honestly…started to get a bit of a handle on.
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Accountability, “second set of eyes”, experience (meaning has made all the mistakes already? ha!), etc. I mean when I was super busy working full time and such between other things, I didn’t always have the time to figure out what was garbage and what was real. I had a coach off and on for a while before I became one, and even since I’ve had a coach for about a year myself.
There’s lots of reasons to hire a coach. Thinking it’s all about some fancy block design that’s gonna make you faster is silly. There’s no secret sauce out there. Some things that work, some things that don’t. Coaches are there to help you accelerate your progress and hopefully avoid wasting time doing stuff that’s not going to work well.
I understand the cynicism toward coaching because you guys are right: it’s possible to do it all on your own. But some people acting like all or even most coaches are out there to steal your money is kind of a silly take on things IMO.
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I personally just dont have the time to sift through all the data and then try to find a work out inside trainer road that meets the criteria. Racing and family and projects take up so much time. Hence the 50ctl
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Disagree here too. I’ve done one of these 3 week dedicated VO2 Blocks this past winter, it worked for me and have the data to back that up. In a sadistic sort of way I’m looking forward to doing one or two this coming fall and winter.
I will say, fatigue had to be monitored and definitely needed a recovery week after the 3 weeks of work. And, everyone’s different. I’m 45 so will react different than someone who’s 65 or 25 for that matter.
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What fields are folks running on their head unit for outdoor VO2 workouts? I’m sure it’s not a good idea to be staring at your stem but just thinking what might be useful as a quick check.
I’m thinking:
- Time of day (usually ride over lunch and can’t be late for work!)
- Lap Time
- HR
- Cadence
- Lap power (maybe not needed if pushing cadence/HR?)
Thanks!
I do like having Power. I did all of my VO2 intervals on the trainer, but I’d go in with a rough power target (in resistance mode) and try to build through the interval. Helped me with pacing sometimes and gave a good starting point.
Indoors I’d primarily use interval/lap time, power (3s / instantaneous and average) and heart rate. Cadence too, but more focused on spinning as fast as comfortable.
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I like the bar graph system from trainer road.
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There’s a bit of survivorship bias. I know as many riders suffering from arritmias after hard blocks of training or racing. You never really know if you are a candidate without trying.