I see this differently: the OP’s problem was an example why the way the price hike was communicated and done is problematic.
Have a look at my arguments: I’m not impacted and have no intention to switch. I am just writing this out of concern for the platform.
Let me give you two scenarios, and you tell me which is easier to sell to (potential) customers: do the price hike the way it was done here or pre-announce it by a month or two and time the release to coincide with a big feature release (e. g. the rewritten desktop apps for Windows and macOS or when analysis 2.0 tools are released). Being successful about selling things is also about psychology and economics. The perception in both cases is quite different.
Think the new pricing would have been over the ‘pain threshold’ for me as a new TR user. When I signed up, I started with a monthly payment, but switched over to annual within three weeks because at the old price, it seemed cheap and a no-brainer.
I’m not sure I would have done that with the new price, especially the annual price. The maths say that the annual discount has decreased. Or put the other way, if you don’t use TR for 3 months a year, you’re off cheaper paying monthly, when before it was 4 months. I’m not a marketing person, but I think if you’re paying monthly, you’re more likely to jump ship for a month and go on zwift. (The 3/4 month cut off is probably something TR can get from their subscription data, so I think this might be an informed decision)
That is not to say that I don’t think TR is value for money, and that they have increased their value, eapecially with the outside workout integration. But as a new user, used to doing things for free (create my own workouts), I’m not sure I’d have signed up.
It seems like a huge increase - 33% for monthly, 46% for annual. US inflation at 1.6%, wage growth at 3.1%. I have to say I’m grandfathered at $99 so for me it represents exceptional value. The problem with this approach is that it makes every incremental increase so much more as you only have future customers to increase subscriptions on.
TR is great, I’ve used it for years. However, the analytics are ok at the workout level but not so great at the athlete level. Apart from telling you how your peaks have improved…what is my VO2 max? How has my aerobic performance improved over the last 12 months? How have I improved as an athlete…or gone backwards…what metrics are there to inform my training…i.e what do I need to train? At what intensity should I train?
The training plans are very basic but the fact that all the workouts are there for you is great…the calendar function is the killer for me…no other app does it better and the ability to swap workouts in/out, push the plan out etc…really neat.
The app works great…so simple…so stable…really good. The fact that @Nate_Pearson says “whilst I am CEO no-one will have their price changed if they continue to subscribe” could hint at the fact that he may not be CEO much longer, what with all the aquisitions…push the price up before the company is bought???
Look, TR is great, it will make you faster, there have been some real good improvements over the last few years, the grandfathering policy is great…if you have been grandfathered…it’s up to the individual what represents value and if as a new subscriber it is worth it…at these prices it makes some of the other offerings out there look good value imo.
The two things that disappoint me though is that I’ve always felt the TR guys are with us, they have our backs. Yes price increases aren’t nice but most people accept that prices will over time go up…but the lack of communication and the sheer percentage size of the increases hint at a distancing of the relationship and a move to more businesslike approach. @Nate_Pearson I hope this is just a one time blip in the road.
I don’t however expect to learn about price rises to a service that I subscribe too via third party social media/blog postings. Communication should have come to all subscribers direct from TR in my opinion.
After using this product for 3 years, I’m probably in a position to be able to recreate the plans on my own. The only things stopping me are the minor inconvenience of doing so, and the hope that continued product developments bring features that make me even faster.
My bigger concern is that recent developments like the calendar and outdoor workouts don’t really do anything for me. At this point, I’d happily pay a substantial one-off fee for the app loaded with training plans and then go my own merry way.
As much as I love TR, this price increase really does change the landscape drastically for any “new” user coming to the training app market.
Of course TR will have done the sums and thought about this a lot - they have already delivered some and promised more new features that appeal to the serious user, who will be more than willing to pay for them.
Targeting that market is fine, but it seems like they are immediately alienating the slightly more casual user who appreciates the structured workouts - the price does not reflect any value to this market whatsoever.
Using a tiered subscription solution seems like a complete no brainer - keep the high end analytics and other “premium” features for the dearer account, but have a “lite” version at a reduced cost which allows access to the structured workouts at least…not only that, but no doubt may lead to a good conversion rate to the premium subscription once a user sees the benefits of the system.
It seems like a win-win for all parties and I just can’t get my head around why it hasn’t been considered - or maybe it has and is something else that is in the pipeline to be released at the same time as some other killer features which would make sense.
I have to agree that the lack of clarity and communication on this one has been a bit off by TR, which is odd considering how open and supportive they usually are.
I will be watching very closely over the following months to see how things progress - its getting to be a very competitive market out there now and heading into a crucial time of the year for training (in Europe anyway).
My bigger concern is that recent developments like the calendar and outdoor workouts don’t really do anything for me. At this point, I’d happily pay a substantial one-off fee for the app loaded with training plans and then go my own merry way.
Indeed. No real useful add-on justifying the price raise. And for Wahoo users, the outdoor sync isn’t ready yet. So wait for the price raise until your product is finished TR. Why we bash Garmin for right?
The training plans are very basic but the fact that all the workouts are there for you is great…the calendar function is the killer for me…no other app does it better and the ability to swap workouts in/out, push the plan out etc…really neat.
Something TrainingPeaks does much better with their native app. ATP etc…
Beyond the basics of sales, this is a good way to lock in most of the existing annual revenue. That’s all that I’m seeing in this price increase and the awesome perk known as grandfathering.
The new annual price would have me checking out my options no doubt. I only get 70c on the dollar in Aus ATM. I’m not sure if the current referrals system would be long enough to get me across the line in that regard.
You have a right to make money when running a business. No one wins if the boss goes broke.
I was on the 15/month plan and did go annual and will pay 189.95, so I’m tricked
first I’m punished for not being a grandfather, grandmother or whatever I have to be…
then I see prices go up 2x/year for services I want but that don’t work (yet) (Wahoo outdoor sync). So I can have a compensation because I’m not fairly threaded as Garmin users?
then I’m tricked as 15x12 is not 189,95 but 180.
And when I want to go down from 189,95 back to 15, the site informs me I go back to 19,95. At least that did the engineer right. Now what?
Note: I was a TR user last year (and before) but did cancel my subscription because of an injury and was basically out for 6 months out of TR.
The coming back to it isn’t a succes so far…I’m really on the fence.
I have no particular opinion on the whole price increase, but I find your postings really contradictory and not really ‘fair’ towards TR/Nate
You first calculated and posted that it was 180, then you go ahead and change your subscription and then claim to be tricked?
Apparently you read the post from Jazir1979 as you comment on the engineering work that relates to Nates response on Jazir1979 that they will have an Engineer have an immediate look at this to resolve it.
The Wahoo support is coming and isn’t all on TR for it not being there already.
Wahoo’s API requires more engineering than that of Garmin’s and from what I could tell on the forum posts is that Garmin was initially more willing to collaborate with TR than Wahoo.
If that’s the case, you should shift you grief on this matter more to Wahoo than TR.
Now it’s my fault?
I got that contradictory from TR as you can see in the screenshot. (website versus MacOSX app).
On the website, I go back to 19,95, in the app I go back to 15. So that’s an error and Nate replied someone will take care of it. Ticket closed.
I’m here to get back in training and have no gains nor advantages being bully towards TR/Nate or any grandfather for that matter.
TR was always my tool for training, so as you might not expect, TR means more to me then you initially would think. (not speaking about the at least 5 people I got on TR) If there is grief in my tone then it’s only because of a disappointment, TR doing things they don’t usually do.
Renewing to annual is only a proof of my preference for TR as a training tool.
I renewed my subscription after seeing this price raise, and that was ‘before’ that reply.
But If you want to start a discussion about when I replied to post xyz…I’m off for the week.
I usually never reply on any forum post before as I always thought it doesn’t matter and is a huge waste of my time. Man, what do I regret I did.
My post is just me and how I tend to react on these type of things when I have the feeling someone is wrongfully blamed.
The way things were posted it seemed like you could’ve known before you changed the subscription.
At least that’s why it came across to me as just putting the blame on TR, as if they did it on purpose (the error in changing from monthly to annual and back).
Great point!! I’m in same boat - wanted to pay annually as decided to keep subscription year round as previously just used it in winter.
I’ve actually not done a Trainerroad workout since February as I’ve been riding outdoors. I’ve kept my subscription simply because I know they’re working hard on improvements and love the fact they’ve developed outdoor workouts (wahoo bolt user here so will have to wait a little longer to take advantage of this) and also looking forward to getting runs integrated as well.
This price increase was done in the middle of racing season for the northern hemisphere, where most users are.
The price increase was not pre-announced.
People that opt out during race season will get stuck with the new monthly pricing.
This could give TR a larger monthly sales rate, which would help if they are acquired.
Nate said as long as he is CEO, grandfather pricing will remain.
If TR is aquired, he might stay on as CEO in an earn out situation. Then again, he might not.
I just hope you guys did some really good numbers on this. I see this as a really great way of killing off new subscriptions and actually losing money out of this increase.
Plus two price rises in a year - yikes! The question then very quickly becomes - when is the next price rise going to be? There were a lot of questions floating around when the last price rise happened and I’d have to review the podcast tapes but I remember at the time Nate being quite reassuring that there were no other price rises on the horizon… now this.
Edit: reviewed the tape - Nate did actually warn then that price increase are a reality and it will happen again… so there you go! The reassurance was all to do with that the grandfathering would always be in effect.
so will have to wait a little longer to take advantage of this) and also looking forward to getting runs integrated as well.