OK, that makes sense. The split nature of the E-Flex is cool, but also makes it tricky. I made a “bridge” for my own setup to lock in the position and alignment. Prior to that, I was sometimes tweaking the final position of the front to what felt centered for steering as well as lean angle. Others have made similar comments. Many people are not that picky and ignore these issues, but sounds like you and I are those that catch it.
Since I have been testing the 2.0 front end from InsideRide, I have not used my bridge. I had some slipping and angle issues while on my laminate wood floor. But since placing the whole setup on a yoga mat, I get less issues. It’s just enough traction and retention more than the hard floor that it seems more stable. I can still mess it up, but only as a result of more sloppy riding that I should prevent anyway.
Just read your google doc. That may actually make it work for me. But then I’m not really having too many issues with my current cheap way of adding movement. Firm exercise mat on the concrete floor, very soft, thick and squishy yoga mat over that, medium firmness mat over that, kicker 2018 with the left and right legs a touch short to make it so they still are in full contact with the mat but allow more lean around the pivot that is the center bar. Enough side to side movement to make the trainer pretty comfy.
The soft center is important so the weight is more spread out from the feet on the firmer mat on top so the smaller feet don’t sink in too easy.
I just ride the trainer for structured workouts during the winter. Still slow though
Meh. Not going to make me any faster.
More interesting to me was how closely the Shimano R9200P tracked with the reference pedal meter when ridden in the big ring.
That is a cool solution, and not too far off from what I did with my 1.0 pipe pivot mod. Some spring centered lean that is largely independent from the steering in put of the regular unit. I am hoping to work on a review video that covers stuff better than my wordy docs. Just got to make the time to start it.
Mostly same boat except I’m still on a gen 1 KICKR that I’ve been riding since 2013 when I sold my CompuTrainer to switch over. I still remember my daily arguments with luddites on Slowtwitch about how the KICKR was pretender garbage and nothing would ever unseat the gold standard of CompuTrainer. For good measure, I also argued with the same people daily about how no PM company would ever unseat SRM and how disc brakes would never come to road or tri but I digress.
My gen 1 KICKR has mostly worked without issue but I guess 10 years now is probably worth considering an upgrade. I’d probably get Zwift hub except for sheer value but since I don’t want to ditch my E-Flex I’ll probably hold out for some kind of sale between now and black Friday to move over to V6.
I also have a Kickr V1 which I ride in the garage. I have some minor pain in my ANT+/BT ecosystem using Trainer Road / Zwift concurrently and the fact that the power accuracy of my unit is useless (bless TR powermatch against my quarq). Still no compelling features that would push me to upgrade currently.
Some features that would get me considering upgrading:
-Interval power stop/start accuracy similar to H3
-Improved road feel. Wahoo is good but they have to go to the next level with their control loop.
-Virtual gearing (hot take: shifting gears on the trainer is blah blah)
I just “jump” the front end of the bike until it feels right… lol
Ha, been there… done that too. It works but it a tad annoying vs a more set and reliable connection.
However, as of my recent testing with a yoga mat under both, that seems to be working pretty well so some form of trainer may may be a good solid for some riders.
I would not do that. I had ‘upgraded’ from a Kickr V1 to an Elite Drivo to a Jetblack Volt which is the Zwift hub. I could not get used to the difference in flywheel weight and the associated difference in spin-up and ride feel… Ended up sending it back and upgraded to a kickr V5 in one of the spring sales we saw earlier this year. Happy silent camper now
This may have been pointed out elsewhere so sorry if I missed it! I’m running a Kickr Core now, and typically using power match with 4iiii left side power meters on my gravel and road bikes. Each PM varies from the Kickr, I assume due to drive train losses. Because of this and potential L/R balance issues, I’m not sure which is “right” and it bugs me.
In his video, @GPLama mentioned he was happy to use the Kickr as a baseline. Do the higher-end Kickr models have an offset to account for drivetrain losses?
I’ve been told they factor in a small amount of drivetrain loss. I suspect this is why the numbers line up nicely in a lot of my ERG tests (waxed chain, no measurable wear, straight chainline used in ERG, etc).
Thank you sir!
Specs don’t mention which WiFi speed it runs at. True the device could probably run at 802.11 b fine with how little data it uses. But having a slow device in a network can slow down everything else as the router has to switch to a slower mode whenever it talks to it. The frustrating part of everything having an Internet connection.
Guessing (hoping)next version when direct connect can tunnel other ant/ble devices over the network? Both for devices that are limited in the number of connections it can make (apple TV) aspect and because when you have dropped signals it is not just the trainer that gets dropped but he, power meter, etc. And if it’s multicast Ethernet data you won’t need multiple ant sticks for each app that wants to read the data (currently at 3 sticks)
Good to hear someone having an informed opinion on the difference
DCRainmaker review after using for a month - he couldn’t tell the difference between the Volt and Kickr Core:
He often comments on not being sensitive to road feel. I’m basically of the same opinion. It’s impossible for me to get past how unnatural it feels sitting back down. That is somewhat resolved by adding motion, but not completely.
At $499 for the Volt it is hard to ignore, for anyone interested in using their own bike, saving money, and training on Zwift or RGT with AppleTV.
If I trained indoors 5 days a week, I’d seriously consider a Tacx Neo 2T (or whatever they might announce soon) with the Kickr V6 as 2nd choice.
yeah, to be honest, I’ve always found this a bit of a hiatus in his trainer reviews as to me there is definitely a different feel to how different trainers ride. I’m guessing it could be related to DC not being consistently on the same trainer all the time. Personally, having been on the drivo for four years I definitely felt the Jetblack had not as nice a ‘road feel’ as the drivo. It would spin up too fast, like when you’re in too light a gear to start pedaling. In fact, even with the Kickr I sometimes still miss the more natural feel of the drivo. To me it feels like the Kickr is breaking just a tad too hard, instilling the feeling of riding through mud. Interestingly, my preferred ERG gear is now one cog lighter on the Kickr compared to what I was using on the Drivo.
For anyone getting into indoor training or upgrading from a wheel-on trainer, yes, the VOLT will be perfect. But when you are in the market to replace a high-end (heavy flywheel) trainer, I think you will effectively miss the feeling of that trainer segment (however you may want to call it)…
I can feel differences too, but they don’t matter that much. Rode in the gym on a Stages SC3 and can tell you the differences but they had no impact on my workout. And to be honest I had an easier time handling 2 hours on the Stages vs my InsideRide + Kickr 2017 + Trek Domane (go figure, wasn’t expecting that).
I’ve used the exact same 30x30 custom workout for all trainers/smart bikes I’ve ever tested, I think close to a decade now.
When I’m measuring, I’m specifically looking for (and counting) the exact seconds from the moment of change as registered by the trainer on TR, to the moment of crossing through the defined set point. I actually don’t care/look at when TR is or isn’t sending it. I’m just looking at how long it takes once the trainer receives that command, to when it: A) Passes through that set-point, and B) Stabilizes at the defined wattage level.
If TR wants to send it early, that’s fine, but it won’t change how I calculate it, since I’m ignoring that part of the situation in order to standardize ERG responsiveness across all units.
If just training indoors I thought the H3 was better than the Neo 2T and Kickr v5? Since it seems like the kickr v6 doesn’t change anything here outside of direct connect the H3 or H4 (I’m assuming the H4 is the same or better, even if just marginally better) it would seem like the H3/H4 would be top pick if just doing workouts