The nature of the workouts in the TR catalog are such that TR has you do for SST and what a duration focused coach might have you do for SST are pretty different. What TR considers a long, brutal SST workout might be a staple mid-week ride for some coaches.
And then you get into “are you doing 90% of a valid FTP number or not” type questions and we derail the whole thread, but that’s the crux of the issue with TR plans for a lot of people… many people are actually doing a lot of threshold work.
Very good point.
If you are basing your endurance riding off power, then hypothetically, your FTP needs to be quite accurate.
Personally, I now use no data on my screens and run purely off RPE. So far, not one ride has been executed ‘incorrectly’. Once you learn the feeling of the VT1 edge, you no longer need the data. Basically, use power, HR and respiration rate to find the edge. Take stock of the feedback.
Endurance riding is then very easy to execute.
I was just interested in Kolie’s opinion on VT1/LT1. I execute my endurance rides similar to his prescription.
Personally I think the only zone that is super critical to dial in is threshold. For zone 2, if you use the “able to talk” test, then zone isn’t critical. For VO2Max, we know that’s not tied to FTP and should just suck in general. Sweetspot is debatable, but more on the high end than the low end. Threshold is the one that if you are doing 105% when you think you are doing 95% you can fry yourself. Even with sweetspot, at least you’re still below threshold unless you are way off. I’m not opposed to testing, I just think it’s overstated.
I actually the opposite. I like the journey more that the destination.
But I get it, training is so time consuming and painful when it doest go your way…
twice a year it happens to me, it’s called your head falling off. Have a week off the bike at Christmas and 3 or 4 weeks in August. Only takes 4 weeks to come back.
I love the training process more than anything. I mean, that’s why I coach full-time now, but I’ve always been that way. I totally understand either side, but I can really identify with people who love to train and watch numbers change and improve but never want to deal with the anxiety and risks associated with racing. Totally get it.
Never experienced that. But, it sounds like you are burnt out. Take some time off or look to cross train via another sport for a few months. Soccer or cross country skiing depending on where you are located.
I’ll take a slightly different angle from some of the other really good responses you’ve gotten here: are you experiencing burnout from another aspect of your life? The reason I ask is that I’ve been struggling for a while with burnout from non-training related issues (mainly anxiety-driven and work-related), and it has completely killed my desire to train. I have events next year I want to do well in, and I still love riding my bike, but training has become a total slog, and I’m just completely zapped of energy. I don’t really have a good solution as I’m still trying to work through it myself (with help), but since you don’t think the training is the source of your burnout, it’s worth considering whether something else is.
This likely has a huge role. I work 70+ hours a week in healthcare and it’s not always the most fun. The bike has been my release. But like you said, most days I don’t feel like hopping on the bike after work and it just feels like a slog. But I do it because I want to get faster. Unfortunately, I can’t change my work anytime soon. I’m hoping it’s a temporary thing.
This forum, likely more than any other on the face of the Earth, is not the best place for a truly balanced response to your specific struggles.
I interact with many cyclists, not one of them (to my knowledge) frequents this forum. They all ride bikes. Some race. Some don’t. Some train. Some don’t. Very few of them ‘train’ year round.
This is, on the whole, the ‘training people’ forum.
Personally, I feel the best advice is ‘periodize’ your year. Not base, build etc. Train or not train. Spend some time just riding, some time training. Play with that balance.
Obviously, we are all different, so finding that balance is the magic.
You absolutely do not need to train. You could never do another interval for the rest of your life and still be a fantastic competitive cyclist.
Right. In the words of Nike, Just Do It™
I find training tough at times, particuarly when I’m tired and struggle with the session, or have to abandon the session and do an easier one.
I also suffer with seasonal depression, but find that TR has been a tremendous help for this, enabling me to train and get my endorphin fix afterwards. It is so cold and miserable in the UK this time of year.
The other thing that has helped with motivation has been going to our cyclo cross races.
I enjoy the fun social side to it, helping out in the pits, etc. Our club has lots of members taking part ranging from under 10s to over 65s (me being one of those!)
I think maybe we put too much pressure on ourselves to train hard, and forget that cycling should be enjoyable as well as keeping us fit. Hence the group/cake rides, and doing strava K and Q OMs!
I think
Tried Zwift racing today. Holy moly. I’ve heard that the starts are hard, but this was ridiculous. I almost set a new PR and still got dropped. Over 400W for close to 3 minutes and still got dropped out the gates. In a C race. It’s like a CX race.
Yep, unlike real races, you have to be at that 400 watts 10 seconds before the race starts, so you’re starting at that higher-end speed. If you don’t pedal until the start, you’re having to work harder to catch back on. It’s easy to get dropped the first several times; just keep going back.
And for a C race, that is crazy, but I’ve heard those people say how their threshold falls in line with that number but are good at sprints and other short efforts.
I think there was a little weight doping/sandbagging as well. There was a guy that weighed 150kg and averaged high watts but was in the category based on watts/kg. Maybe he was actually 150kg, but it kind of seemed like a high weight for a flat race is great for keeping the weight/kg low, that is, he had an avg power of 341 for a W/kg of 2.3.
Sounds like a HELL of a carrot on a stick to keep you enjoying training 
What was this in terms of of watts per kg?
How much of that 400 watts was in the draft?
Which C race was it? Just in case I need to avoid it in the future. 
Dude …
Did another Zwift race on Sunday and I gotta say, even though it doesn’t race like a normal outdoor race, it’s pretty fun. Like I’m still learning the nuances of powerups and drafting and such, and the strategies for Zwift racing seem to be quite different than outdoor racing. That said, it definitely scratched my raving itch. Maybe a bit too much. Given my very competitive nature, all I want to do now is race everyday. Which isn’t going to benefit me long term.
So my question is: how do you guys incorporate Zwift in your training? Races specifically. I’m doing a lot of Z2 right now during the week. Would something like all long Z2 rides M-F then a race on Saturday and/or Sunday sound doable? At least for base. It would give me something to look forward to on the weekend.