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That is likely, but depends on the factors you mention. But more leverage on the same structure (along with likely shorter distance between the headset bearings from the shorter head tube length) can lead to more “give” in the steerer. That of course will vary with each fork, material and actual design (thickness, layup, etc.) as to how much you gain in that “give”. Stiff forks won’t make much difference vs those that commonly aim for lighter weight and are more likely to flex.
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I mainly mentioned it since some level of downsizing will lead to a max height of the front end (without crazy stem angles) that may not work for everyone. So many unknowns without actually fitting someone and knowing what bar drop they want or can handle.
Yeah this is true of me - I worry about having too much seatpost exposed, for example. This is why I tend to go for models like the SuperSix with the “traditional” horizontal top tube, rather than a sloping one like a TCR.
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On the HRV issue, and the criticisms of the way the podcast dealt with the topic, I will just mildly point out here that it was only through googling that I saw that Marco Altini is the founder of HRV4Training and regardless of expertise, is therefore entirely compromised as an unbiased source.
My understanding is that independent, peer-reviewed research into HRV as a tool for endurance training is limited, and the podcast reflected that.
My own anecdotal experience is that HRV works on a macro basis - when I’m ill, it’s down, when I’m well, it’s up - and also responds to strong inputs. For example, it does tend to go down after a race or particularly long ride, and plummeted really low the morning after I was hit by a car. However, on a micro basis, just dealing with normal training weeks, I’ve struggled to make the smaller fluctuations tally consistently with the training I did before / the sleep I had / how well I’m feeling / how well I’m able to perform that week’s workout.
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to be honest in one way or another many people are biased… there is research into many aspects of HRV and Marco though owner of that platform has published extensively meaning it was peer reviewed and bias noted/ conflict of interest statements. The key point is he is a good read and does talk about the strengths and weaknesses of HRV. The people on the podcast from what I heard were not well informed and thus an exert voice may have added to the discussion where I felt the bias presented in the podcast was to say it was not all that useful. If you want unbiased go to the Harvard med site Heart rate variability: How it might indicate well-being - Harvard Health, there are other users such as Alan Couzens Overtraining: Using HRV effectively | Alan Couzens. So it can be useful but like everything GIGO… you need to understand the limitations and how to use it, a simple number is not the whole picture. So if you are averse to reading Marco’s work try these or the many others out there like Thomas Gronwald, Stephen Seoler etc who have published on the topic.
I agree in general with your assessment (I think it is key to understand to the need to have a trend to draw from, and a point item is not enough data, it is are you within your normal range?) but disagree there is not much research on the topic.
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I heard Amber say something interesting whilst discussing traing at altitude. She said that at sea level we are breathing off CO2, abd at altitude the limiter is O2 saturation. I was wondering if we know where the crossover is?
I personally find HRV and resting HR really helpful data. If I’ve been ill, I don’t get back on the bike until it returns to normal. I have also noticed that I got a dip in stress levels (increased HRV) immediately after recovering from a bad case of flu. So back to normal does not necessarily mean low.
I don’t get chance to comment on the forum these days - I’m currently isolating with a mild cold like case of COVID.
So I want to take the opportunity to say how I appreciate everyone’s contribution on the podcasts. There are soooo many valuable insights in every one. The authenticity and courage you all bring to the microphone is a true inspiration to me 
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The HRV topic needs Chad’s deepdive, maybe in a few months time they need to revisit the topic and dissect it a bit further, only the surface was scratched this podcast.
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I think they may be developing it. Nate mentioned something a few podcasts back about a feature they’ve been working on and said something along the lines of, make sure to wear a HR monitor during your workouts. He even said that he didn’t always wear his but started to because they were using the data for a feature. I wouldn’t be surprised if it was HRV related.
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I had the question from the live chat that was featured in the Episode about whether my FTP is now increased that I spent at least 2 days racing for 90 minutes or great at 1.0 IF. I am indeed a fairly new TR user, since Dec 2021 but a long-time user of structured workouts and doing FTP tests.
Well on my AI FTP detection done Tuesday, my FTP didn’t increase at all so I think that’s super weird. Because based on experience I know it’s higher. I went ahead and manually increased it about 10 pts. and these workouts seem to be doing fine for me. Just frustrated that AI didn’t pick up on this change.
If you haven’t already done so, please submit your feedback and experience directly to support@trainerroad.com so they can review your case. They are keenly interested to see what they can learn to help improve experiences across the spectrum of riders.
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This could work fine with an incorrect FTP in theory depending upon the workouts, ya know? A few watts difference in FTP may not make a difference enough in your workouts, depending upon the zones, to be the difference between achievable and not.
Always check with support@trainerroad.com so they can make sure everything is being considered/credited when creating an estimated FTP. 
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thanks, sounds good!
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Support ran things on their end and did indeed confirm that my FTP was higher even than I estimated! Sweet! Bring on the tough workouts😂
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I’m a bit to the party and just listened to the podcast - I heard Jonathan mention something that’s really a common misconception. On advising a listener on how to relax after an evening workout he mentioned a cold shower as a way of lowering core temperature.
That’s not correct - even though it’s counter intuitive, a warm shower or a batch will decrease core temp, cold shower or even worse an ice bath cools you down for a short while but natural body reflex is to aim for homeostasis, which in effect raises core temperature.
That’s why we feel sleepy after a hot bath and a cold shower has quite an opposite effect.
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HRV …. A competing training site podcast 
covered this topic really well on one of it’s early episodes. They seemed well informed and really dove in on monitoring it with Whoop and using the data to adjust your day’s training if needed. IMO, this could be a key piece of data for smart adjustment training algorithms in TR. If TR could somehow incorporate resting and training HRV into the algorithm and adjust your workout recommendation accordingly, that would be a huge advantage for those of us with very complicated lives (non-Pros). As a rural hospital Emergency Physician I work 24-36 hr shifts - sometimes with a few naps in them and how I feel coming off those shifts is extremely variable. Sometimes a do a lot of shifts over a week, sometimes I have a week off. To further complicate matters I race kayaks as much or more than bikes. Those workouts are not even considered in the TR algorithm because they aren’t tracked. I’m sure there are other cyclists who also kayak, SUP, surf, climb, play tennis, hike, whatever. The point is, there are a multitude of potential life stressors that won’t affect a dedicated pro or‘ high level cyclist, but DO greatly affect the masses trying to follow these plans. Maybe HRV is the missing key.to measuring body stress from untracked activity and adjust the workout accordingly.
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While I would like FasCat’s use of HRV (or something like it) to succeed, I think it is way too early to draw conclusions at this point. As a data nerd, I’d really like this to work, but I think we should remain skeptical. HRV trends seem useful to quantify how well you are, but the tricky bit is to make quantitative decisions (= modify your training plan by e. g. adding or subtracting intervals, increasing rest, etc.) based on that.
What also is not clear to me is whether this really provides another data point in addition to power, heart rate (e. g. heart rate recovery during rest intervals) and RPE. If you are basing your decisions on those three, would you do worse?
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Id forgotten about this podcast I’ll have to check it out as I’m playing with HRV. The Elite HRV app with Polar H10 is giving me a wide range of numbers though. It was giving me 80-90 last night and no lower than 65 sitting but doing a plank it only read about 30 and this morning standing just out of the shower it gave me 27. The only thing I can see so far is I’m not a morning person 
You make good points. How do you apply the data from these activity+recovery devices to a plan? It’s impossible to know at present. But maybe if someone at TR looked at the Oura/Whoop data from a lot of users, they could come up with a workout adjustment algorithm in the same way that TR has experimented with feedback data from our workouts to establish the algorithm currently used to make adaptations to future workouts. Maybe HRV could be used as just another data source, like our post workout feedback. The only way to establish a useful algorithm is to look at workout / recovery data for many users using Oura/Whoop with TR and sharing the data. I wonder how many TR users are currently using Oura/Whoop? Asking TR users to invest several hundred dollars a year in a new data device is definitely asking a lot. Neither device is cheap and we already spend a lot to be competitive in this sport. Maybe they would find that the data is irrelevant for most users and only relevant for someone like me. Hard to say unless you look.
I am not the typical TR user, so I don’t fit well into the plans or current adaptation algorithm. Because of my work schedule and equal, if not greater commitment to kayak racing (not monitored in any way by TR), there is no way the TR algorithm can accurately make adaptations to my workout as I can’t even follow anything close to the proposed TR calendar. I was musing at the possibility of using Whoop / Oura data to help other users like me.
Since my post I’ve been doing more research on Oura / Whoop. The Whoop is more expensive but is focused more on helping athletes. It’s probably unnecessary for most TR users who can follow the calendar and have a job that allows them reasonable recovery after every workout. I work 12-36 hr shifts once or in consecutive stretches (with 12-24 hrs off) for up to 10 days. This will be followed by a few days off to over a week off. During these off times I’m juggling kayak training and bike training and sometimes a run. I also do strength training. How am I supposed to know how to plan workouts around that? Even a well trained private coach I think would have a hard time telling me what to do.
I think I’ve decided to invest in the Whoop. According to the FasCat podcast, it’s designed to help people just like me with complicated schedules to help them decide how to adjust their workouts to varying degrees of stress and recovery.
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Agreed, that’s one criticism I have of TR’s current approach: they are not collecting enough relevant information by e. g. not having Apple Health integration. They can’t even investigate these questions at present. There are some situations where e. g. monitoring left/right balance over time is important , say, when an athlete is coming back from an injury.
Yeah, I think someone like you needs to develop a really good sense of how well you feel on a given day and understand how much of a load you can take. Why don’t you report back here after having used a Whoop for a while?
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