Ever wonder what happens when you put a tire on the wrong way?

Thats correct but there is also an arrow on the side of the tyre.

Pretty sure it makes no difference for GP5ks though.

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It makes a massive difference. You canā€™t go to any coffee stop without someone pointing it out if itā€™s the wrong way :wink:

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Thatā€™s half of what coffee shops are about: trendy folks imposing trendy social norms.

The other half is addicts feeding their jones. ;-D If you kick your habit maybe you can roll with your tires on backward unimpeded by social pressures.

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Continental GP5kā€¦This is looking from the drive side.

And this is from Continental is all Iā€™ve ever really found regarding the directional arrow. Again, for the GP5k if it makes a difference itā€™s not noticeable. Not saying there couldnā€™t be. But, just not worth much worry IME.

Now to be clear, for some off road tires the direction plays a much more noticeable roll and care should be taken to mount directionally correctly.

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I donā€™t think the GP, GP3000 or the original GP4000 had those arrows. I certainly never noticed them. I only read on a forum 3 or 4 years ago that there was a hard to read arrow and sure enough I had my tires on backwards. :slight_smile:

I think they added the arrows around the time of the GP4000 II S.

I remember there being a big discussion about running Motorsport slick tyres (specifically Kart tyres) backwards (they tend to wear heavily on one side and this could be a way to extend their useable life in theory).

There was a point made, though I never really knew if it was true, that if you ran the tyres backwards they would essentially unravel due to the way the rubber is applied.

From what Iā€™ve seen of tyre manufacture Iā€™d have no qualms running a tyre the wrong way in terms of failure or anything. Iā€™d see it as having a potentially dramatic effect (both positive or negative) on MTB/maybe gravel, but I canā€™t see there being much effect at all on road. The siping is so miniscule :man_shrugging:.

I understand that Brandt is a giant in the history of cyclingā€¦ Iā€™m not willing to take everything as gospel though.

I have more than a few issues from my (admittedly non-tire expert stance) reading of that quoted info.

I donā€™t generally like any sort of moto - bike comparison, but since it was brought up in thereā€¦
Why do they use specific wet tires with pattern/grooves in MOTOGP rain? Itā€™s a way bigger money/tech/science sport than road bike racing is, so I assume itā€™s done for reasons after careful development/consideration.

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In this case, he is correctā€¦.the contact patch is so small and the pressure applied in such a finite area that whatever tread patterns are used on road tires are for marketing purposes only. Even in wet roads it doesnā€™t accomplish what tread does on a car tire (give water a place to go) because the contact point is so small, it pushes the water pit of the way anyway.

The above is all based on multiple conversations with tire product guys over the yearsā€¦.

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Iā€™ve heard schwalbe mention this too. They said the tread on the pro ones was only for marketing because there were people out there that wouldnā€™t purchase a slick even though tread served no purpose on a road tire.

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I purposely did not mention car tires for a reasonā€¦

I have a bit of background experience in vehicle dynamics etc, yes it is super clear to me in terms of cars given the very different shape of a car tire vs a bike/moto tire, the way a car turns vs how a bike/moto turns, the PSI in a car tires contact patch and how it is distributed vs a bike/motoā€¦

I donā€™t at all deny that there is a visual and marketing perception aspectā€¦ Even for me it is easy to simplify and associate slick with road, patterns with more aggressive all-around or off road use etcā€¦ Product people love creating constructs of differentiation so that there are more categories and more products that people must have.

Right, but most people donā€™t get thatā€¦.they associate tread with ā€œperformanceā€ or something that is ā€œnecessaryā€ on a tire.

On a road tire, tread doesnā€™t accomplish anything in terms of performance (Iā€™ll leave aside the discussion of aerodynamics as it pertains to tread patterns as that is not what we are discussing here)

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I still am not 100% there in agreeing with such a black/white statement in the Jobst quoteā€¦ But of course Iā€™d also say that Iā€™ve never had the sensation of hydroplaning on even the wettest rides my bike with slick tires, whereas Iā€™ve definitely had it on numerous occasions in the car.

I think you just answered your own question. It may be because how we relate to car tires that make us feel like we need tread on a road bike tire. At same time manufacturers say its useless, but weā€™ll put tread on to make people all warm inside.

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I know Iā€™m being a PITA, but going to my original response, it was regarding the quote that ā€œmotorcycles have shown that tread patterns do not improve wet traction.ā€. I still think that is not a true/up to date statement.

Because of physics, you really canā€™t compare two completely different sports. A wider motorbike tyre can go fast enough to properly aqua plane and they want to avoid that. Whereas cycling, a completely different sport, has a tyre which is too narrow and canā€™t go fast enough (relatively) to properly aqua plane. On road at least, tread is only for show (a sales gimmick, folk expect it so its better selling), a narrow tyre (on road) actually cuts through water like a knife through butter. Off road, with loose surfaces adding another dimension, tread is needed on a bike however :+1:

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Iā€™d heard the tread on a GP5000 is for aerodynamics. Contis are supposed to test well in the wind tunnel and to do that you need a small amount of tread on the shoulder

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Came here to say this.

I follow KTM in the moto GP. One of their riders won recently when he stayed out in the wet and everyone else pitted for treaded tyres. He might have saved time and won the race but it was a b@llsy decision, he was all over the place and the other who lost definitely benefited from tread by not having brown trouser moments :open_mouth:

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Not sure how much there is behind it but I know ENVE were saying the tread serves for Aero purposes; conveniently optimal aero needs to say Enve though :grin: (though to be fair I think Enve say that the Conti 5000ā€™s are a touch more so). From the old Bike Radar article: Enve enters road tyre market with aero-optimised tubeless rubber - BikeRadar

ā€œEnve claims the tread pattern (which is made up of parts of Enveā€™s brand logo) has been specifically designed to improve aerodynamic efficiency. It says the tread acts as a ā€˜trip edgeā€™ that energises the airflow, helping it to remain attached over the transition between the rim and tyre.
It also claims this effect works at the rear wheel too, where the tread helps to close the wake of the airflow as it transitions off the tyre, leading to a smaller low pressure wake behind the wheel.ā€