Hi all,
just wanted to know if someone has created custom workouts of the “endurance intensity” type? Basically, going under LT1 and then a little over LT1 and so forth?
Said differently, it would be switching between Endurance and Tempo…
I am hearing of those lately from Seiler and others, and was curious to try 
Thanks
Sina
Oh here we go…
How do you test for LT1?
What is Zone 2?
What is FTP?
ad nauseum 
Well, if you want to be absolutely exact it’s difficult, but does that really matter…probably not. And one can get ballpark very accurate, as with other things.
I am looking for workouts just as image below. Thats it, not crazy LT1 discussion.
So, tempo over / unders? This seems easy enough to make yourself. ride easy z1 / then Z3 (around 80% of FTP).
I’m curious. Where has Seiler suggested recently to ride tempo? (That would be his grey zone.)
Yes, and I was wondering if someone has built similar stuff already in TR.
You can either use the workout creator or use the new style endurance workouts TR recently added to the library - then up the intensity during the intervals
Probably one of the FastTalk Podcasts.
Now, there are many ways to do the infamous “Z2”. you can do it at the upper end, as Inigo San Milan is promoting or you can do it at the lower end as Cousenzs is more akin to. Indoor I ride maybe 1-2h, so the San Milan prescription appears more suitable for me, which is “Tempo” in the TR categorization, for example, Phoenix -2.
So I was looking for exactly what you say, Tempo over/unders, just to mix it up a little and maybe go a little harder in the interval and again back down. Well, should have just built myself 
Tempo is easy enough that you can do as long an interval as you like. 5-10-20 minutes shouldn’t be a problem.
I hit my best numbers ever the year before with a tempo build - a lot of 3x20minute sessions and some 4x20s. One could also string together a lot of 5 minute intervals with 1 minute rests if you wanted. I don’t think it matters how one gets to the endpoint. Just keep increasing time in zone and keep fatigue in check.
edit: tempo build inspired by Steve Neal:
I think for MOST people it would be difficult to ride at the very top end of z2 for 15-20 hours a week (high volume) without some sort of burnout and staleness. At higher training volumes a lot of your riding will HAVE to be at the lower end of z2 just so you can recover. Obviously you might be able to handle a week or a month of it, but at some point the fatigue will build up. Like if your FTP is 300w, I think going 220-230w for 20 hours would be very difficult, where doing 160-170w for 15 hours and 220w for 5 hours probably would be ok.
Funny - I was reading your exchange with Steve Neal on FTL’s forum yesterday. I’m getting my thoughts gathered and planning for next season. It’s safe to say you are doing a blend of your plan with TR this year?
Agreed, but since I can not ride 20h, especially during the week only maybe 1-2h per day, I do a little more intensity.
I like 80%. I use wko zones which defines tempo as 76-88%. It honestly doesn’t matter but I don’t think more is better with this type of training. It’s best to be a touch conservative and then use Neal’s HR cap to make doubly sure you aren’t going overboard.
No, I just do my own thing and design my own workouts. This past year, I took 8 months off the bike (running, rowing) and then started from scratch in March. I’ve hit 91% of my previous all time high on half the training load.
I’ve come to the conclusion that training load is the key to all of this. You can get there any number of ways and it really doesn’t matter that much how you get there (TR, Fascat, sweet spot, extensive/intensive, tempo) as long as you manage fatigue. In the recent Greg Lemond topic and podcast/video he describes his pretty simple process:
tons of base
six weeks of build until his legs were about to fall off
rest
sharpening
win Worlds!
A tempo build is a great way to induce this training load IMO. You can increase CTL without the wheels falling off too soon. You still need the rest/easy weeks. The Steve Neal HR cap is just a nice way to gauge when to back off if the cardio vascular fitness is not there.
After my first tempo build I was making new PRs in 1, 3, 5 minute powers without having done any specific above threshold training.
Hey there!
The TR Workout Library has a lot of endurance/tempo workouts that sound like they’d fit into what you’re looking for.
You can filter your search based on duration and Workout Level to narrow things down.
Great insights, thanks for sharing that.
I’ve been been reflecting on the training plans I completed this past year as well as what I did 20+ years ago whole racing in college while using Friel’s Training Bible. I always came out of Build 3 really strong and fresh. Build was 8 weeks back then before tapering and I’m thinking that 6 weeks of build will be more suitable for me at this age.
After trying the polarized plans these past few months I don’t think it provided enough training load even though I regularly added Z2 hours to all my outside rides.
Next time around I will follow a more traditional training plan ala Friel, and make sure I have a solid base with a shorter build. After all I’m still just experimenting with how I respond to different training plans.
I think one could flip/flop between polarized and a more traditional build. Like:
Polarized base - lots of easy base miles + 1 hard workout per week (4x8, 8x4, whatever.). Take a rest and then switch to the build.
In season, switch back to a more polarized approach - one workout to keep you sharp, 30/30s or something, all other rides easy to keep you fresh and recovered, plus group ride/race/event on the weekend.
Thanks, there are some, but not exactly what I was looking for. Still, the low-level Tempo rides and the high-level endurance rides around over 90min fit in the category I was looking for.
In the winter I use the -3 versions of Phoenix, Cumberland, Polar Bear, Gibraltar or Pioneer depending on if I have 1-2 hours to train…it’s tough especially near the end of the 90-120 min versions but doesn’t take to long to recover - in the summer I ride on the roads and can actually raise the power a bit - easier outside. I have some lovely level routes where I can keep the power consistent at about 200W which is about 70% FTP for me.
This is exactly my experience as well. I like to do 4+ hour trainer ride on the weekend and I can do it relatively easily between 60-70%. But most of TRs longer endurance workouts have parts which kick up >70% and the intensity at 3 hrs into an endurance session is noticeable. Also, I think going above 70% in an endurance session negates some of the desired outcomes (i.e., mitochondrial biogenesis, fat oxidation, not induce a sympathetic response).
