Makes sense, and it definitely feels like riding overgeared. It’s a bodycraft vr400, I believe…and probably a few years old. Stroke rate is around 26.
I poked around to find any manual resistance knob/lever, but that doesn’t exist. And the computerized ones only seem to increase resistance. I’m like Nates size, 385ftp, and rowing for 30mins at 26spm feels like mid tempo work on the bike. Can’t imagine being 120lbs and trying to use that machine.
Following up on my own post. I’ve found it’s not actually glute muscular soreness/tightness, but nueral tension in my sciatic nerve.
Been doing lots of flossing and rolling and stuff to address it. That’s seemingly cured issues with my feet (which is amazing), but still feels like there’s a taught metal wire in the back of my hamstrings that’s tender and just won’t loosen up…and gets magnified with rowing.
updating after some time:
I have been rowing regularly now for several months, mostly steady low effort sessions of 5k to 10k, sometimes mixing it up with several short 500m sprints or longer intense intervals (1000-2000m).
I also started to do daily stretching and upper body workouts.
Meanwhile I reduced my cycling from 4-5 sessions per week to 0-2 depending on the rowing sessions and the weather outside.
wow… i feel better than ever… no back pain at all (which I used to suffer from a lot) and my body got into great shape, much more pronounced muscles and much more balanced between upper and lower body in terms of fitness…
love it and will go on with it
btw this all took me much less time per day (1-2) than the earlier intense focus on cycling only (2-4h)
and btw2 although most “serious” rowers do recommend the Concept2 rowing erg I am more than happy with my waterrower. The water sound and the design are awesome and I dont feel I am missing out on the more serious data the C2 gives.
That’s great.
I’ve been looking for a rower for six months since I read this topic. I’m still not 100% sure I’d love rowing but I think I could easily fit in 2x10-15-20 minute sessions per day just to boost my general fitness and compliment my cycling.
I can’t find a used Concept2 for any kind of reasonable price with less than a 3 hour drive. We live in the sticks. A new Concept2 is $990 and people often ask $900!
I did find a used Model C with a PM3 computer for $350. It’s old but looks good, advertised as working well. I may give that a try to get started.
I’ve got a Concept 2. My fear with a water rower would be that it might develop a leak at some point and they would be heavy to move around when filled.
i dont think the WR can feel any heavier than the C2, even filled up. It is very easy to lift it up, roll it around and put it against the wall in the corner. Certainly the wood design makes it much more bearable in a flat than the C2.
Within a normal usage scenario I also do not see a reason the tank would leak
Go for it - low risk. You would probably be able to resell it for a similar price later anyway
And if you like it you can upgrade to a PM5 for $160 and still be way ahead. I have an almost 30 year old Model C that still works as well as it did the day I got it.
Found a local to me Model D with a PM5 for $750. Looks well cared for and is 6-7 years old. 3 million or so lifetime meters.
Is 3 million considered “low mileage” for one of these? How many meters per minute does one typically row?
I wouldn’t see that as high mileage. And so many of the parts are easily replaceable which is one of the reasons they hold their value along with just being well built.
I’ve got close to 4 million on my current one (2 years old now) and I consider it brand new. My former one had 11 Million and had to replace the bungy cord once, but otherwise, still like new. I took the old one to my daughters house to use when I visit her. These things are virtually indestructible.
Thanks. I did some research on meters per minute and came up with a napkin calculation that 3 million meters equals about 200 total hours.
I’m picking up that model D this afternoon. It looks a million times better than the $350 Model C that appears to have lived it’s life in a small gym.
I’ve found cheaper Model Ds but they are often 3-4-5 hours a way in the middle of nowhere and I’d rather pay an extra $100 than drive an extra 8 hours to score a deal. This one is just a few miles from me.
Good luck. I wouldn’t say I love rowing but I like it as a change of pace for my cycling training.
You can find some good technique and workout videos from dark horse rowing and RowAlong. Plenty of others too.
Concept2 has their own app called ErgData which connects to the PM5 and they have a workout of the day or you can create custom workouts. Another good app is ErgZone which connects to many different workout providers.
That’s what I’m looking for. I actually just took six months off the bike. I’ve kept in shape through running, lifting, snowshoeing, and XC skiing. I just got the bike setup on the trainer to get in shape for the spring and I’m planning doing some rowing every day on top of it.
I generally row 1-2 days a week. Run 1 day a week. A bike 2-4 times per week. At least currently where I’m not really training for a race. And most of my rows are short. 20-30 minutes or somewhere on the 3000-6000m range.
But overall I like rowing for fitness. I like that it gives me some upper body engagement compared to biking.
Ha! I think that’s a common installation mistake but normally people figure it out.
What rowing apps do you folks like? I have Concept2’s ErgData. It doesn’t seem to do a lot more than the PM5. I guess the advantage is that the app will upload to Strava. I got my HR strap hooked up.
My first couple of sessions I noticed that I’m not using the legs a lot. I’ve watched various youtube videos and they suggest initiating the stroke with the legs. I’ve tried that and got more leg engagement. I’m still surprised that the leg push is still pretty short.
I did a 10 minute session and noticed that it was hard to get my heartrate up to my Zone2 level. Once I got up to 125-130bpm, it was getting quite hard compared to that being pretty easy on a bike.
I learned to row with a masters group one season. The cue I internalized when the coach said I had good technique was focusing on really driving my butt backwards towards the person behind me (imaginary on an erg, quite real on an 8).
The effect was it’d drive my hips backwards while maintaining close to the same forward lean as I had at the catch. Arms as extended as possible (w/o overextending the shoulder). The forward lean didn’t change much until almost at full leg extension at which point it became a backward lean. Once the backward lean was near complete then arms would go from mostly extended to bringing the oar into my chest. The last bit was more about controlling the oar than adding much power.
It’s not nearly as steady as cycling. The initial acceleration is where much of the work occurs. The best cycling analogy I can think of is if you took 2-3 hard pedal strokes (the leg drive), 2-3 normal ones (the end of the leg drive transitioning to the lats), followed by coasting for a few seconds (the recovery).
Hopefully that’s helpful, anyhow.
If you’re over-using your arms and upper body that’s not too surprising; smaller muscles won’t drive the heartrate up to the same bpm (for an equivalent RPE).
One of the best things about the C2 is that all machines are calibrated to give accurate and repeatable results. (unless you row at elevation, then your body will rebel). That’s why you can race and log results and know they are comparable to other C2’s anywhere. Because of this you can post your results on the C2 rankings website where you can compare your times or distances and be ranked in the world, country, age-group, weight class, etc.
For training, you can buy plans from Training Peaks and learn technique from YouTube videos. It will take longer than you think to become competent on the erg.
The only thing I don’t like about the C2 is their Performance Monitor. It is still quite primitive and even though they developed an app for the phone, it is still missing some training functionality, so I don’t use it. Sometimes I just short-hand the days workout on a yellow sticky note and stick it to the machine where I can follow it.
