The following might seem controversial. To me it is at least. But considering the huge amount of carbs that our body needs according to the Energy Availability Model on which the newly launched TR nutrition calculator is based, then imagine that you first and foremost make sure to eat a wide range of real food based on many different colorful vegetables, grains, lentils, beans, lean meat, fish and seafood, etc, and in this way get your fat and protein needs covered, along with a good portion of the carbs. Furthermore, such wide range of food sources should also make sure that you get all the vitamins and minerals you need. When all of that is eaten you are probably quite full of healthy food. However, if you have 7-10 mostly hard hours of cycling per week, like in my case, the Energy Availability Model tells me that I still need more carbs.
In that case, would there be anything bad in just topping up with candy and soda? Not chocolate and cake, since that also include fat. But the energy source in candy and soda is after all pure carbs, and in principle not that different from sportsdrink and gels.
What do you think? Please let me know where I am wrong. To me it seems controversial if candy could be a part of a daily nutrition plan.
I use fruit snacks + Gatorade powder when Iām on the indoor bike. Works as well as any other sports nutrition, Iām only pushing ~120g carbs/hr usually though.
Only thing you need to watch out for is getting enough sodium, if you were previously getting that through your sports specific nutrition.
Thanks. The question here though is not so much about what to eat and drink while on the bike.
It is rather if it really is that simple that if your first priority is to get your everyday nutrition through plenty of real food in many variations plus whatever you get while training, then you can just cover the remaining carbs need by something as simple as candy?
As a side-note, let us assume to be a bit selective with the candy and try to avoid too many artificial chemicals (if that is possible)
While possible itās generally advised against that much sugar off the bike. Just eat more of the healthy stuff to fill the gap if possible. Can be an adjustment for sure.
Iām eating about 5500 calories a day and only 800-1000 of that is sugar/candy (all on the bike)
Looking at the way the macros are calculated in the (TrainerRoad) energy availability model, the protein and fat amounts are the same every day, regardless of the amount of activity. Only the amount of carbohydrates fluctuates. And the carbs fluctuate directly with the demands of the activity.
So, I think it makes sense to look at the macros for a rest day (no activity) and fill that amount of each macro EVERY DAY with quality carbs, proteins, and fats. From there, the additional calories for activity days can likely be any combination of āgoodā or ābadā (e.g. rice vs soda), and should be generally consumed before, during, or shortly after the exercise itself.
Personally, Iām ok with using sugary candies as a part of this mix, but I try to stay away from sodas, simply due to the combination of ingredients in them, but this might be just my personal preference.
This topic actually came up on the TR podcast this week with Dr. Podlogar. He specifically mentioned sugary drinks and candy/gummies as a reasonable way to fill in the carbohydrate gap when struggling to get enough through more āacceptableā things like rice, potatoes, pasta, etc. It shouldnāt be the basis for any diet, but can be a good supplement when struggling to get down that huge plate of pasta, rice, etc.
Iāve really been trying to clean up my diet this season and have mostly avoided this kind of stuff off the bike. Itās been good for body comp and some other things, but Iām struggling to keep weight stable and energy high for my workouts at times. On big days, itās been really, really hard to eat enough carbs without including simple sugars. And Iāve had to cut down on fueling on the bike due to some acid reflux issues, so thatās made off-bike fueling even more of a challenge.
I just did the math. Or rather Gemini did it for me.
As I more or less wrote earlier I gave the following input: Consider the rest day targets as a daily basis, and those targets are meet every single day through a verity of homemade food with many different colorful vegetables, grains, lentils, beans, lean meat, fish and seafood, etc. Would that cover the needs for vitamins, minerals and other supplements to support general long-term health? I am a 41 year old man, 79 kg, 188cm tall, bodyfat around 12-14%, cycling 6-10 hours per week and doing strength training a few times a week.
*Remark on the active days, according to the attached nitrition plan, I would top up with additional carbs to meet the energy needs.
How much simple sugar does the carbs needed to fuel the active days correspond to on a weekly basis?
*
To that Gemini confirms this rest day diet based on real food would support general long-term health, and if the additional carbs comes from simple sugar it corresponds to around 2,1kg/week.
Now let us say that I get 100-120 gram carbs per hour while cycling (that is actually what I already do), that would still mean that I have around 1 kg pure carbs per week left in the energy budget, that I could simply meet by eating sugar from the jar with a spoon!! Or what? It is at least hard for me to get intro my brain that that would not challenge the general long-term health, though I cannot tell why since the basis from real food in the described scenario is in place.
If you can do it, the goal should be FUEL HARD with simple sugars on the bike. If you need to do every workout 100-120 g/hour - thatās the best time to take in carbs.
Off the bike, ideally you eat healthy carbs and stay away from candy and high sugar stuff. You can see health issues from too much sugar, and constantly spiking blood sugar even when weight is stable. So no, you donāt have free rein just to eat what you want off the bike.
First, make sure your āRefuel mealsā are solid. Big plate of pasta or rice after your big/hard workouts, and again focusing on carbs the two meals before your big hard workouts.
Outside of those, ideally Iād be focusing on veggies, fruits, whole grains, etc. And, if you are taking in sugar and snacking - donāt make it all the time so youāre constantly elevating blood sugar.
What works for me:
100g+ an hour on the bike (if I need it, maybe not on easy Z2 / recovery rides unless Iām behind - be smart)
big bowl of rice with some eggs is a great refuel meal. Get a rice cooker and have it hot, cooked, ready to go when the workout ends to make it easy.
Potatoes, Rice, Pasta with Dinner. Throw in a dinner roll, some bread if you want more
Bagel every morning if I have 2.5 hours or more until workout, or Iāll go closer if itās just Z2
My snack will be sourdough pretzels if I need it.
Snack on Fresh Fruit
looking at my last couple weeks - my harder weeks are in the 9000-10,000 kJ range on the bike and I personally donāt have an issue staying topped up on top while still hitting protein targets. For me - the issue is always leaning down, not getting enough fuel.
If Iām needing more carbs on a daily basis due to longer / harder rides or workouts I will add dates to my protein shakes. I believe it will be less of an insulin spike being in the mix with other foods. It is also easier on my teeth.
If you feel you need to top up with simple carbs outside of riding, Iād try and do that immediatly before or after rides, to minimise health risks. Bloodsugar spikes stay surpressed for quite a while after exercise, so if you nail a bag of gummy bears directly after your ride, there is probably not much difference to doing that during the ride.
Think you mentioned it before, but Iād also try and have something that is basically just sugar, without too many extra chemicals. While the occasional chemical-laden sweet might be harmless, it adds up if you end up eating a bag full of them multiple times per week. The same might be true for high amounts of fructose - you need some fructose to fuel with high amounts of sugar, but it is probably better to stay away from extremely high ratios.
This is exactly what I do. I have healthy and structured meals that I keep similar day to day for breakfast, lunch, dinner and a few snacks, hitting the same protein and fat targets. Then I add carbs for the pre/post training meal, and during the session, and these carbs are typically more processed for fast absorption. I even created a tracking app structured this way - glycogo.fit. Would appreciate any feedback!
Iām still waiting for someone to discuss the little tidbit Jonathan dropped on the podcast 2 or 3 weeks ago (the last one with Alex, the nutritionist), but I guess I need to start it . They went over a study that, after pre-feeding to do their best fill the glycogen stores and then used some special newer imaging tech to measure the subjectsā muscle and liver glycogen stores, and then the subjects did a workout designed to empty those glycogen stores (and the level of those stores was again measured), and then they consumed carbs on a schedule over, I think, the next 12 hours to refill them (and again using the tech to measure the time vs percent refilled of both the liver and muscle glycogen stores), it was revealed after 12 hours the muscle glycogen stores were not yet full (seems like it was 60-70%, maybe), and also the liver was like 140% of the originally āfullā volume a couple hours after they got off the bike. Thatās how I recall the discussion, anyway.
Jonathan seemed to be interested in this info, but neither he nor Alex really tried to address the 140% full liver after a couple hours. I donāt know about everyone else, but from my understanding, I donāt want my liver being flooded with fructose and overflowing with glycogen when I am at rest. Am I wrong in my understanding that the liverās function, as far as retaining a store of glycogen, is that it primarily acts as a regulator and backup for when your blood glucose gets dangerously low, to keep the brain running? In other words, after a ride, when youāre taking in plenty of glucose, which in turn is maintaining your blood glucose (that is getting transported to your muscles to refill them), the liver isnāt really needed to participate in that blood glucose regulation, except for its signaling for more insulin.
I could have this all wrong, but it seems logical that, with steady intake of sugar, if the muscles are going to take 12-24 hours to refill their glycogen stores, but the liver glycogen is āoverfullā (my word) after only 2 hours, there might not be any real hurry to take in a significant amount of carbs shortly after the ride (except for the small amount in the recovery drink that has been established to enhance uptake over the next however many hours, I guess), and especially if those carbs are high in fructose that we know too much of can be unhealthy for some people in some circumstances (non-alcohol induced fatty liver disease?). Does the extra 40% of that 140% capacity proceed to get turned to fat and deposited around the liver and other organs, while causing unwanted inflammation? I donāt know, but that was my first thought. Maybe maltodextrine would be better than glucose in that post ride shake, and let the liver stores refill with regular meals with slow carbs, over the next however many hours.
. They went over a study that, after pre-feeding to do their best fill the glycogen stores and then used some special newer imaging tech to measure the subjectsā muscle and liver glycogen stores, and then the subjects did a workout designed to empty those glycogen stores (and the level of those stores was again measured), and then they consumed carbs on a schedule over, I think, the next 12 hours to refill them (and again using the tech to measure the time vs percent refilled of both the liver and muscle glycogen stores), it was revealed after 12 hours the muscle glycogen stores were not yet full (seems like it was 60-70%, maybe), and also the liver was like 140% of the originally āfullā volume a couple hours after they got off the bike. Thatās how I recall the discussion, anyway.