Big same. FWIW my outdoor workouts look like this
so I don’t feel like ERG has hamstrung my ability to perform in outdoor scenarios heh
5 Likes
For me personally, erg encouraged mono cadence and that made my outside riding worse. But it’s an easy fix - just change up cadence in erg. My bigger issue with erg is that it doesn’t feel natural. So after 2 years of erg I turned it off and no interim turning it back on. Then doing workouts in sim mode. That made it a lot better - my butt didn’t get sore, I naturally was working on cadence versatility, and I was doing the work. Plus my InsideRide e-flex forces me to use stabilizing muscles like when riding outside.
If you love erg then keep on keeping on. Sim mode for me, and if I had a do over I’d probably get some InsideRide rollers.
2 Likes
Have an OG NEO. For a long long time I’ve run largely in erg mode, but lately experimenting with resistance. I really hate shifting on the trainer, but nevertheless slope mode has been a positive experience. In erg mode I notice the resistance changes as my cadence wanders a few rpms up and down. In zone 2, tempo, and sweetspot this isn’t too distracting. But once you start getting into threshold and vo2 workouts those little kicks to bring cadence back to what I’m trying to hold become very fatiguing, especially since 1 or 2 rpms at high power are a big deal. Running really high cadence helps, I think mostly because it minimizes the torque variance. When the trainer is in slope mode the resistance is vastly more predictable and I don’t have to surge quite so hard to get my cadence back to where I’m trying to hold it.
I am jealous of what appears to be your perfect 10 minute hill.
2 Likes
@craigmanning totally different angle, that hasn’t been mentioned:
Maybe erg is actually the perfect tool that will help you improve your cycling immensely, by making you realize your natural “best” cadence is much higher than you thought. It did for me.
Abt 5 yrs ago I was always 65 - max 80 RPM in sprints. Started reading [books, not just opinions online! 
] and learning more, learned that “best” cadences are highly rider specific, but usually around 85 - 100, while pros can often run at 100 - 120. I was shocked. It was recommended I do some ultra high cadence work, way out of my comfort zone. I put in a couple weeks of drills working up to 95, 105, finally 110-ish for minutes at a time. After my legs got used to being able to do that, I got back to doing what I wanted to do…
And pretty much instantly, my natural cadence for high-power, like Thresh + above, became 90 ish, and 95 - 105 in intervals at 110+% FTP.
Also instantly, I stopped dragging the anchor, my performance on intervals went way up, I started to enjoy the heck out of them, and my FTP started increasing more than it had in the past.
I also “spin up” my flywheel about 4 - 8 RPM faster than I’m going to do the interval at, just 1 - 2 s before it hits, this avoids the dreaded “inertia + new higher load shock” ; it’s now just higher load, and settling back into it a bit feels MUCH better than smashing my ankles into a brick wall.
[Saris M3 Magnus; wheel-on. Definitely ain’t my “amazing trainer’s better road feel.” 
]
3 Likes
FWIW, my H3 made me largely stop using ERG mode because I couldn’t find gearing that felt comfortable, and I used to use ERG frequently with my Tacx Flux S.
I’m not one who harps on ERG mode being less effective or anything like that. I think people should use what works for them. I just largely dropped it when I switched trainers because the RPE was way higher than I felt like it should be. It wasn’t due to a difference in power readings between trainers either because I had been using power meter pedals and PowerMatch before and after making the switch.
1 Like
That is why I think it might be trainer specific. The RPE does seem harder in ERG.
I have no problem with higher cadence, I can ride on the road all day and average close to 100 rpm. I only race MTB now and that requires being able to slog along in the 60’s on super steep climbs, but you cant train for that in ERG, at least not on an H3. Slope mode is the way to go. I had a Kickr Snap in 2018 (POS BTW) and I used to be able to get that flywheel humming along in the big ring, small cog and do 300 watts with seemingly little effort and pop out 2x20’s at FTP and barely break a sweat. That seemed like the opposite of the death spiral.
1 Like
It’s a good half hour for me if I go all the way from bottom to top! All the faster cyclists in the area use it for their twenty-minute FTP tests every spring. It’s 
amazing , super consistent grade, one intersection you can sort of skip if you go on the sidewalk, and almost no traffic, just sheep.
1 Like
back to your original point, you are on an H3 and said “your cadence falls below 80 and it feels like you are pulling an anchor through wet georgia clay?”
Yeah, I felt like that on a Kickr direct-drive in Erg, its what I meant by unnatural. Another way of saying it was it feels like I start fighting the trainer, its not something I experience outside (hence unnatural).
Good tip… I have used erg due to laziness but was getting frustrated with lag. Tried standard today for the first time and enjoyed the control required and changes in cadence… felt like I was actually riding. Will probably alternate between the two depending on workout.
1 Like
Thanks @BCM and @mcneese.chad for suggesting a higher gear for more flywheel speed. I just tried this out on a threshold workout I was worried I might fail. It really helped. I ended up only rating the workout “hard.”
I have always used a bigger cog. Since I use ERG mode and never shift gears, my thinking was I wouldn’t wear out a larger cog as quickly. But man, the smaller gear and faster flywheel is a way better RPE experience.
1 Like
I ditched the smart trainer and went back to a dumb trainer. I prefer outdoor workouts, but for indoor I don’t use ERG.