I live in a Pan Flat area too (east of England) but 90% of it is psychological IMO too. I don’t often go to places with proper climbs but I’ve been to Tenerife, Calpe, Majorca and the French Alps (Marmotte) and survived ok. If you can develop the power on the flat you’ll find that last 10% when you hit the climbs you’ll just inevitably go slower for the same power. What freaks me out maybe from lack of experience of them is the long descents but others are better at that so maybe its just me 
2 Likes
My experience doesn’t match this. While aerobic fitness is in play regardless of grade, the pedaling dynamics change significantly as the grade gets steeper. That changes how force must be applied during the pedal stroke and recruits muscles in a different way. I spent a lot of years avoiding hills like the plague and my ability to put out watts while climbing was significantly lower compared to putting out watts on the flats. I’ve been working on improving my climbing since ~2018 and my climbing power output has improved significantly and is much closer to my flat land power, but still lower. It’s not through lack of trying (I did almost a half million feet of climbing already this year prepping for my race season), but I’m still not a great climber compared to the extended power I can do on flatter courses.
3 Likes
That sounds psychological to me, don’t fear/ avoid hills. Smash it on the flats in between proper recovery and you’ll get there, good luck👍
I live near Boone, great area. Hope you enjoyed it!
1 Like
Better or just prepared to take more risks?
1 Like
Yip, the latter, prepared to take more risks which makes them better, its like 90% of things in cycling its phycological. I let my lack of dexterity due to chemo damage play on my mind too much :-/
I didn’t read anything psychological in grwoolf’s post that affected their climbing abilities, other than avoiding climbs prior to 2018. I read:
- Pedaling dynamics change
- Force applied during the pedal stroke differs
- Muscle recruitment differs
- They’ve been working on improving climbing since 2018
- Improvements, but still not same as flatland power
- Half a million feet (>150k meters) this year
That sounds like a phycological step they need to get over and they can.
Curious that you ignore everything else they stated, including:
I’ve been working on improving my climbing since ~2018 and my climbing power output has improved significantly and is much closer to my flat land power, but still lower.
Also
It’s not through lack of trying (I did almost a half million feet of climbing already this year prepping for my race season),
Also including all of the physiological reasons.
I can assure you that I haven’t spent the last 5+ years working on the psychological aspect. I don’t subscribe to the “watts are watts” theory, it just doesn’t work that way for me. I can be very fit from intervals on the trainer and then go try to do those intervals outside and struggle with the same power/durations. If I haven’t been climbing much recently, my muscles will be very sore the day after doing my first big climbing day (even when the ride is much “easier” than what I’ve been doing regularly).
For me, the physiology is different and I suspect it is for most. Doing 350 watts spinning at ~100rpm on the flats is a very different effort for me compared to doing 350 watts up a 20% grade at ~80rpm. If watts were watts, why do almost all riders climb at a lower self-selected cadence when climbing vs. on the flats? There are fundamental differences in the pedaling dynamics due to the constant load when climbing steep grades.
2 Likes
They’ve clearly stated that mental barrier that they need to overcome then listed off what they feel are more barriers but IMHO they are not as big barriers as they are making them and things have just manifested. I’m probably doing the same with descending tbh. Whilst 90% of statistics are made up on the spot 90% of cycling is phycological and the earlier @grwoolf poster can overcome them and I wish them all the best in doing so.
Is no one gonna mention the effect of gravity when climbing?
lol! I too live in east of England (East Yorkshire) and my cadence when I went up Pico Valeta 2 days ago was 62.
1 Like
I would agree that a lot of training is just getting your fitness up as high as possible. But I would also include blocks to extend the TTE at ftp and/or sweet spot. Getting used to applying pressure for 40-90m is helpful. Also climbing definitely feels different then putting out the same power on the flats so doing some climbs I preparation is really helpful. If the climbs go to altitude it also helps to do some altitude climbs before so you know how you react to it…
Because very few riders have the gearing or w/kg to spin at 100rpm on 20% gradients
according to Bike Calculator at 77kg with my lump of an 11kg bike I’d expect to ride at 6.74kph up a 20% gradient
running 700x28mm tyres according to Bicycle Gear Speed Cadence Table | BikeCalc I’d need a low gear of 26:50 to achieve 100rpm
The lowest gear typically found on roadbikes is 34:34, with the same size tyres at 100 rpm thats 12.8kph to ride up a 20% gradient at an assumed WT pro rider weight of 65kg on a 7kg bike you’d 552W !!
1 Like
Maybe not strictly aaplicable as I ride a MTB but I find climbing is different to flat.
Most of my climbing work is done on the trainer, a block under the front wheel and in the lowest gear possible (small ride front, large at the back) I find due to the lack of inertia this best simulates climbs.
Oh, and weight plays a big part, cut out the cookies a few months before the event 
I live in a flat area but competed in stage race with approx 3000+m climbing per day without blowing up on the climbs.
Nice climb 
My mate has moved to around there and I’m extremely jealous 
I’m further south in Pottyboro (Peterborough) with the Fens immediately to the east of me (The social ride in them has 236-368 ft in 20miles depending on the barometer)
The last time I bothered to take my own bike was to Tenerife (I mostly just hire) and my cadence on my first two times up Teide was 64 and 65prm but on my 3rd time (6th day of cycling) it was just 56rpm. Strangely enough I was faster for it, 0nly 67s faster though. The day before I was track standing my way through tourist traffic up Masca and my cadence was down at 49rpm 
1 Like
Most climbs aren’t 20% though. At least do something like 5%, 7%, 10%, 12% to give a flavour of power and cadence and speed.
Indeed. I provided my numbers here: How to train for long climbs? - #31 by sasa
Here’s a 43 year old esports champion who has trained exclusively indoors for years.
Virtual Velo Podcast Episode 49: Kristen Kulchinsky & Josh Lipka -The Zommunique
Kristen recently learned how to ride outdoors and has won every hill climb race she’s entered typically by a wide margin.
No doubt a naturally born talent with a climber’s physique helps, but an amazing story nonetheless.
I especially like her enthusiasmm for learning new skills from clipping in to drafting and how to TT.
The puncture with sealant shower on the final wall at Mt Washington adds more zing to her story.
1 Like