TR have discussed protein on the podcast a few times in this context. As endurance athletes, we are constantly causing muscle damage that needs to be repaired. Protein demands are actually quite high. Body builders target their workouts to not cause the same muscle damage and thus gain hypertrophy.
Remembering my mixes from heavy training years, I’d have 200g carbs, 30g protein and electrolytes in a 1L bottle and bring two of those on a 4h ride. I was not gaining weight.
Do you have protein powder? I have 2 scoops vanilla protein powder in my morning steel cut oatmeal (1/2 cup dry steel cut has 10g protein). That puts me at 70g protein just in my breakfast. Usually have around 40g in each lunch/dinner which puts me at 150. Often have a small Greek yogurt (15g) over the course of a day, and I’m at 165g protein and I weigh 155lbs. Usually have other misc snacks with a little protein as well.
I also have a very high amount of upper body muscle for someone who is primarily a cyclist. The older people get, the more Important muscle mass is from a pure health and longevity perspective.
The older you get, your ability to take up protein diminishes. Hence why it is recommended to eat mote protein as you age.
Yeah, the point I keep trying to make though is that I don’t want to solve it by just slamming 100g of protein via powders a day.
It seems like every response is to use more though, so I guess I understand why so many people can’t relate to my dilemma.
Meh. I know it’s currently en vogue, but I don’t really buy that for 100 years cyclists didn’t need much protein and suddenly need 150+ grams a day.
‘Benefit from’.
I don’t use powders, just a variety of foods.
We also didn’t have high-carb, bicarb, aero bikes, power meters, etc., etc., for quite a long time.
Getting in the right amount of macros is certainly a massive driver of adaptation. 
It can be tough to get enough protein while keeping fat in check without using some amount of supplements, but it can be done if you eat enough legumes! 
You’re right, and those guys were still beasts, which was my point.
I do appreciate the beans comment. It’s another case though of having to eat a TON of them to hit these goals though. I guess I either need to just give up on meeting these goals or start consuming a lot of powder. This whole “eat way more food and lose weight” thing might work, and it’s definitely enticing, but my stomach isn’t happy with it. I’m feeling stuffed all the time and still not hitting the goal. I guess more powder would solve this, it just doesn’t seem very healthy to me to consume so much of it. I either need to do what it takes to hit the goals and see what happens or stop fussing about it. 
Yeah, they were fit, but they would have been a lot faster and healthier if they had today’s nutrition.
Between dairy (milk, yogurt, cottage cheese), egg, peanut butter, beans/green peas, and chicken/lean meat, I’ve found it’s not too hard to get there, but it does take effort.
I personally don’t think there’s anything wrong with a good quality protein powder, especially if you’re getting some of your protein from other sources.
It depends on whether you want to optimize or not.
I’m 60 this year and I don’t want to get old man body - you know where one loses muscle mass as the years go on and look more and more frail. There are many studies that show that most Americans under consume protein, especially in the mornings (cereal), but it doesn’t really catch up to one until their senior years.
On one hand you could say that most seniors are fine despite eating less and less protein and losing muscle mass but I don’t want to go down with a broken hip some day or anything frailty related if I can help it.
I’ve been following the work of Prof. Don Layman. He advises protein and fat targets similar to Kyle Pfaffenbach who has been on the podcast several times. Layman’s work is nicely summarized here:
I was also going to say that I don’t know anything about the TR Energy Availability calculator but one may not need 350 calories on a 1 hour endurance day. TR’s messaging is often geared towards young 20-30 somethings. Losing weight (being in an energy deficit) and trying to train are often competing goals. It’s hard to do both.
Let’s be honest. “Optimize” changes definition every few years, often contradicting what was “optimal” just a few years in the past.
I wouldn’t be afraid of a high quality whey protein powder. I do one scoop first thing when I wake up every morning. Sometimes during the day a big smoothie with frozen berries, a scoop of whey, skim milk and greek yogurt (Love it, tastes like Ice Cream and extremely healthy). And sometimes, a scoop of whey right as I’m going to bed.
I don’t think it’s some all of a sudden thing or a fad. I think athletes are doing more, going faster, setting records, recovering better. Part of that is learning more what helps from a science, nutrition and fueling perspective, and higher protein is a part of that. And science is always learning more - so yes, of course it’s continuing to change and you should expect “optimal” will continue to change.
If I was trying to lose weight, I would be making sure fat intake is maybe at the recommended guideline, but definitely not more. Then, it’d be making sure I’m not over-consuming carbs. The fact of the matter is a lot of our Z2 work is burning stored fat stores, so you don’t need to treat every calorie burned as glycogen you need to replenish. With that said, I am still making sure I’m loaded up before hard workouts or long days in the saddle.
Let’s just say I’m not a protein skeptic. I’ve been studying the area for a number of years and I’m on board.
Wait, I thought the old ones rode with a steak on their chamois so it would be tenderized and ready to cook up for dinner or something like that?
Gives a whole new meaning to Strip steak! Or is it beef tenderloin?
Is it any different than putting drink mix in your bottles when you ride?
du bœuf du peloton
As someone who has a hard time staying under my protein goal (84 kg body weight, so in the range of 150 - 160 g), I always wonder about this type of comment. What actually is your target and are there foods that you are actively avoiding e.g., are you vegan / vegetarian / lactose intolerant?
I usually have 4 meals worth mentioning (breakfast, lunch, afternoon “snack” / pre-ride, dinner), and each one has 20 to 50 g worth of protein without resorting to protein powder. Usually the following:
Breakfast: Oats, dairy protein (e.g., 250 g low fat greek yoghurt), fruit → 30 - 40 g protein
Lunch: 200 g chicken, rice/grains, veggies → 50 g protein
Afternoon: lately rice pudding with just milk and rice → 20 g protein
Dinner: e.g., Potatoes, 200 g cottage cheese, veggies → 40 g protein
This already is around 140 g without any hassle (at least for me)…
Add in on the bike nutrition and the odd snack, maybe top off with a recovery shake if absolutely necessary (I skip it), and you should be set…
Edit: Not saying you should eat like me, obviously. I just wanted to point out that having a “dedicated” protein source in each meal drives the protein intake up quickly without resorting to excessive amounts of protein powder.
Your numbers don’t add up for me. How are you getting 40g protein out of 200g cottage cheese and veggies? How much oats are you eating that you’re getting 40g protein from them and 1 cup yogurt? It would have to be a lot of oats! Add in the yogurt and fruit, and that’s a massive breakfast for me. 200g chicken for lunch is a very large lunch serving, especially if you’re eating other things with it. Etc. You’re talking about a lot of food here. I definitely would not say it’s easy for me to eat that much.
One trend I have noticed here is that I workout in the morning, and a lot of the people talking about how they hit their goals are eating huge breakfasts and working out late in the day, which I don’t tend to do. Also, at 190lbs, my target, according to the TR calculator, is 190g, which is considerably more than you’re eating even though we weigh almost the same and would leave your example above 50g low for the day.
Huh, let me see…
Breakfast:
65 g oats: 4 F, 38 C, 8 P, ~160 kcal
250 g Quark (German fresh cheese, macros somewhat comparable to greek yoghurt): 11 F, 9 C, 26 P, ~240 kcal
Handful of berries ~50 kcal
Total: ~450 kcal
lunch
200 g chicken breast: 2 F, 0 C, 46 P, ~200 kcal (where I live, this is one medium chicken breast, so I would not consider this a huge portion)
100 g rice: 0 F, 80 C, 8 P, ~360 kcal
Total: 560 kcal + veggies + oil/butter
Afternoon:
400 mL whole milk: 16 F, 19 C, 14 P, ~270 kcal
100 g short grain rice: 0 F, 80 C, 7 P, ~360 kcal
Total: ~630 kcal + Fruit / berries
ride nutrition
60 - 150 g C / h
Dinner:
200 g cottage cheese:8 F, 2 C, 26 P, 184 kcal
500 g potatoes: 1 F, 73 C, 10 P, 355 kcal
250 g broccoli: 1 F, 7 C, 7 P, 85 kcal
Total: 624 kcal
All these meals are not huge calorie-wise and also not huge volumes (at least for me 
) Again, fine-tune with high-carb snacks or adjusted portion size, but the general gist of my post remains valid, I think.
Edit: I’m aware that in this example I’m low in fats, which for me come in through butter/oil, sauces and snacks. I usually hit 100 g F in my day easily, it’s just time consuming to add every little item in this way.