Absolutely. I think I said prior that new bikes coming out from western brands 2-3x more expensive than Chinese brands released at the same time. Many are made in the same factories. I cant comprehend the business model except greed. “Research” is mostly done by computer modeling these days, its not that expensive.
I think it’s less about greed and more about perpetuating a model that is fundamentally broken. Too much overhead spread across too few bikes. In the grand scheme of things, high end bikes are a tiny market. There are no economies of scale, particularly for the smaller companies. If brands like Factor, and Felt, and Allied all made a million bikes a year, they could sell them for a small fraction of the current price and generate a ton of profit. Hard to say the companies are greedy when the are struggling to stay in the black. How many Epic 9’s does specialized have to sell to fund the off road team (riders, mechanics, etc.), all the designers and engineers, pay for the distribution centers, etc., etc, etc. I have no idea how many Epics they sell a year, but even a popular bike from one of the biggest brands isn’t being produced in big numbers compared to typical consumer products.
I saw the new Factor Sarana in the wild today at a gravel race. And a buddy of mine built one up last week as well and gave it a glowing review (of course he did, new bikes are always awesome). He did say that race king 2.2’s were a pretty tight fit (no go for mud), but I’m not sure how tight is tight in his eyes.
Here’s a pic of the one I saw today, nice looking bike.
Just came across a better GV201, the Spcycle G028. Chinese frame with 57mm clearance, frame storage, udh, decent amount of mounts, decent geometry and 27.2 post. Looks like spec wise they have taken the hint. Probably not aero but if a crux can win, maybe this is close enough?
Looking at the recent slash of the Levo E-bikes, there’s either a wild inflation of pricing just for pricing sake, or they are going to lose a lot of money trying to move them.
Greed may have been a strongish road, yet the constant redesigns and the need to upgrade all the time is a part of that. Specialized is probably the worst with new version in a shorter timeframe than most companies. Perhaps that’s how they beat that scale question - if you don’t sell many Epic’s to start with, make the consumer buy and buy again.
I won’t say greed, but making money is absolutely a part of it. Every single one of these companies is a For-Profit enterprise that has a responsibility to it’s owners, employees, and shareholders to make them a return. They’re not out here to promote biking just for the greater good.
Smaller direct to consumer companies have a structural cost advantage to companies like Specialized and Trek, and even moreso no-name factories in China have a cost advantage.
But don’t conflate that with being more profitable at the end of the day than any other business. Would I invest my money in a public company that sold bicyles or owned a bunch of these brands? Hell no.
Part of what? Are you really faulting a company for trying to make their products better to stay in front of their competitors? It seems that you really want to believe there is some kind of evil motive here, but these are just companies trying to stay in business and grow. I certainly wouldn’t defend all the business tactics, but the bike industry is generally filled with people with a passion for cycling (in my experience). If someone’s primary motivation was making $, the cycling industry would be pretty far down the list of places to go looking for a job or starting a company.
Agreed ^^^
The notion that bike companies are making new bikes to try steal your money that you shouldn’t be spending on a bike but are “forced to” because they released a new model…is crazy.
They are a for profit entity that will only continue to survive (and therefore employ their teams and give us new bikes) if they are successful in their mission of remaining profitable.. comparing someone like Spec to a no-name Chinese carbon brand and calling them greedy is a fundamental misunderstanding of the business..
My argument is that IMO the business is changing. As noted since Covid the bike industry is struggling yet the prices have gone up insanely. Rumors of $15,500 for the new Crux while the X-Lab entry is $3,200. So my statement is the changing business is being challenged by a new model of which the western brands aren’t adapting but instead are asking more for the new Crux than the Epic.
Apparently the new aero argon 18 anti matter is 14.5 watts faster than their dark matter.
that’s a huge improvement - almost too big to believe!
Probably a stretch in a best case situation, but that’s directionally similar to the benefits from aero road bikes when they first came out. Keep in mind that the 14.5w claim is at 45km/h, so you won’t be seeing that kind of benefit except in very limited situations. But it’s good to have it when needed. And even if it’s only 3-5w advantage in “typical” situations (lower speed, in a group), that’s huge over the course of a long race.
Those seat stays are a bit weird looking, but I bet they soften up the ride and probably contribute to the aero gains. And I’m happy to ride an ugly bike if it’s faster and more comfortable.
just wait, its true
thats a pretty good saving, assume a CdA of .25 a saving of .012 is about a 5% reduction in drag. at 20mph that’s about 5.3w. A good skinsuit saves around .015m^2 of drag btw.
What’s true, that Specialized is releasing a bike with THREE derailleur pulleys? 
I think there are a lot of people that just don’t know what a rear derailleur looks like anymore. They saw 3 because the guide pulley is in the “wrong” place.
This has to be it. I think all the people saying there are 3 are counting the pivot point as a pulley.
Does anyone have race experience on the ARI Shafer? That bike looks promising, but maybe too long and slack to be considered a race bike. But it may be smoother in the end.
The Shafer is one of the bikes that has a geo that perplexes me. The geo is closer to MTB land than road yet gravel racing is more road than MTB, for me at least.
My LBS has started carrying Scarab and I am lust full for one, but they are dang expensive.
Starting to think about getting an Otso Warakin. It isn’t a fancy aero bike, but it fits big tires, should fit me like a glove and looks dang nice.