Workout Levels V2 update? [Unstructured Rides]

People like riding outside? :open_mouth::open_mouth:


Good question. I do listen to them all, but I don’t specifically recall the answer to this. I would assume the potential is there… but not sure how that would be handled.

I bet it would affect ‘Train Now’ recommendations. If a big level increase is detected, I bet it would adapt planned workouts to be on-par with the new level. But maybe not adapt planned workouts downward in account of fatigue? I have no idea.

My personal conspiracy theory is that it’s done and ready to go, but they are trying to figure out how to handle the influx of angry threads, YouTube videos, and support requests when the 2hr coffee ride and hammerfest to the next stop sign yields no level changes.


I would like to see daily training time availability thing come out first that has been spoken about. This way we don’t get confused about what plan to pick instead what hours we can train. I think that would help people a lot more than getting a +.1 of a PL change for a group ride.


I don’t use it anymore, but one thing I remember really liking about Xert is that it measures this. I think they call it XSS or something like that. It also takes into account that it’s harder to do that Z2 block after doing a set of sprints, for example.


Another mention in today’s podcast:


Seems like they’ve been talking about this forever.

And each time do, they are more excited about it and say it’s going to be even more awesome than the last time they talked about it. I’m excited and very much looking forward to it too. But as they get more excited about it with each mention, I get more frustrated than the last time that it isn’t released yet.

And now, we’re into group ride season yet again when we could really use it and it’s still not ready… but, hey, it’s going to be so awesomely great and it’s almost here and they’re just working through some bugs and, and, and… we should keep on subscribing.

I suggest they adopt a simple software developer principle - Ship it or Zip it!

  • I understand the sentiment behind this, but it’s the opposite of the greater majority of thoughts shared by the forum when Nate asked about sharing (or not) the future plans and features they were cooking. Perhaps the results of a poll could differ today, but Nate is abiding by that prior poll and discussion at this time.

All true but Nate is not sharing any updated roadmap priorities - the subject of the poll you linked to - about V2

He said it was the #1 priority, remains the #1 priority, and has been almost ready, so close, going to be released real soon, etc. per Jonathan, Ivy, and Nate’s periodic mentions since last fall. It’s just being promoted, frustratingly so for me, with these continued mentions that are not even being prompted by forum or podcast questions.

It’s way past “teasing” at this point and sounds more like marketing - Jonathan’s even sharing his experience riding with it and telling us how great it is - during a period when the developers are working their darndest to figure it all out.

I’d be pissed if i were a developer and wish they would just say no more about it until it’s ready and relieve any added stress on finishing it. I’d expect they are putting enough pressure on themselves already.


I understand your frustration and I’m frustrated with it too, but just to show we don’t all want silence in case the TR folks are reading, I’d like every update we can get! I appreciate @mcneese.chad sharing the link too since I rarely listen to the podcast any more.


I want to hear updates too and looking forward to using it even in Beta version. But they aren’t giving us updates. Just telling us it’s close but not ready (and will be great)… which is the same thing they’ve been saying for months.


Agreed. They’ve been hyping it so much for so long that I’d hope it’s amazing for the number of times we’ve been told it’s right around the corner. I want to give the crew the benefit of the doubt, but man does it feel like we’ve been waiting for ages.


I imagine one of the reasons they are being so careful is because of the downstream effects. IE, if it improperly updates your PLs threshold, vo2, and etc., it has the potential to completely disrupt a training plan.

I could imagine someone doing a threshold workout were riders inadvertently go into vo2 max as they go up a hill, it evaluates it as a vo2 max interval, and then their vo2 max PL gets set too high and subsequent training is set too hard. This would really mess up AT.


Good point. It would definitely detract from TR’s core function if training recommendations are damaged due to improper level adjustments. I can see why avoiding the release of this thing prematurely is so crucial.


Yeah, if they had beta-released early summer 2021 (a few months after initial announcement) I think people we recognize the likelihood of hiccups at that time and cut them some slack. Fast forward to now, and even if they opened beta tomorrow… I predict people will hold their feet to the fire a bit more considering the time delays.

They kind of painted themselves into a corner with a long promised buildup & the delays. If it has issues (even minor ones?), I think there will be minimal tolerance for that despite the clear beta status for anyone gaining access to the feature. The time and mentions, along with the “we want to get it right” comments as the reason for the setbacks is setting a pretty high expectation.

All remains to be seen, but this will be interesting to watch at launch from a number of levels.


I think both approaches have merit and come with a set of trade-offs. I’m totally fine waiting, and like to hear periodic updates. It’d be so easy to release something that isn’t fully cooked, and I am glad they don’t.


It’s kind of crazy that something this simple doesn’t get done……ohh the the pains of legacy code.


Two thoughts:

  1. I hope there is the ability to have unstructured outside rides “scored” but not used to change PLs. I might be a unicorn, but as I do pretty close to 100% of my structured workouts inside I only want what I can do inside on my SB20 to impact my structured inside workouts
  2. I think from a product perspective TR is in a hard place. They’ve made big feature bets that suck up close to 100% (my opinion) of their development resources, so if they don’t talk about these big unreleased features the service seems static to users. From the outside it doesn’t feel like there is some amount of capacity dedicated to making small improvements/ adding small new features/ improvements.
  1. What exactly do you want scored that isn’t already done if you exclude PL?
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Score the PL of the outside ride, but don’t factor it into my PLs used by adaptive training to modify scheduled workouts

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