# Wahoo Kickr or Tacx Neo? (and discussion on STAC Zero Halcyon) **URL:** \ **Category:** Equipment\ **Tags:** trainer\ **Created:** [October 24, 2018, 2:19pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482 "2018-10-24T14:19:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Thomas\_De\_Kesel](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/thomas_de_kesel/32/13052_2.png) [@Thomas\_De\_Kesel](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Thomas_De_Kesel)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 8:44am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/23 "2018-10-25T08:44:43Z")
Yes i am having issues with the kickr 18 . Crazy noise and you feel it in the pedals . ---
**Author:** ![Papuass](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/papuass/32/162_2.png) [@Papuass](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Papuass)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 9:05am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/24 "2018-10-25T09:05:07Z")
Have you checked the level of support available in your location? It will be expensive and inconvenient to return the device for warranty case. Also Tacx Neo will be cheaper than Wahoo Kickr in Europe and the other way around in USA. ---
**Author:** ![mcneese.chad](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/mcneese.chad/32/15056_2.png) [@mcneese.chad](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/mcneese.chad)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 12:19pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/25 "2018-10-25T12:19:54Z")
Sorry for your luck. ☹ I hope they make it right and get you a proper unit. ---
**Author:** ![Thomas\_De\_Kesel](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/thomas_de_kesel/32/13052_2.png) [@Thomas\_De\_Kesel](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Thomas_De_Kesel)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 12:29pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/26 "2018-10-25T12:29:10Z")
Yes they are "dealing with it " but it takes a long time , 3 days already . Should be simple once they hear the video i made that is why once i get a replacement from Wahoo i will send it back and get a NEO instead ! ---
**Author:** ![brenph](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/brenph/32/15649_2.png) [@brenph](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/brenph)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 3:36pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/27 "2018-10-25T15:36:55Z")
> [@mcneese.chad](#): > > For you choice, I am effectively anti-Tacx. I don’t like what I have seen from them over the years WRT how they handle defects and the continued use of clearly flawed designs and products. Just to defend slightly… and while its poor form having faulty equipment out there… Right now there are three of us in the club with faulty Flux (the 8616 batch)… all of which are being replaced no questions asked and at no cost by Tacx (even including the shipping… I doubt it’s cheap shipping 25kg of trainer from Ireland to Netherlands and back). I’ve actually been using my one without issue for over a year and the noise never bothered me but my brother noticed it recently and told me it was the same noise his was waranteed for. A quick email to Tacx the next day and I had a return shipping label with zero hassle. ---
**Author:** ![julianoliver](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/julianoliver/32/229_2.png) [@julianoliver](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/julianoliver)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 3:42pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/28 "2018-10-25T15:42:18Z")
Thanks everyone for their thoughts and experiences. It sounds like my initial impressions were pretty sound, both are good trainers, both have issues, both have happy and unhappy customers. For my purposes, I believe both would do an excellent job, being located in the US, I think the $200 discount is what will pull me to the Kickr over the Neo. With November upon us, fingers crossed this trainer is discounted in the sales season as in previous years. A follow-up question. What can I expect in changing from a wheel on trainer (Snap) to a direct-drive (Kickr)? I’ll be happy to never have the risk of coming down to a punctured tire before a workout (that’s happened a few times) and I’m hopeful that the Kickr will be less faffing about (tire pressure, tire slip, etc) and respond to power changes in TR better. Thoughts? ---
**Author:** ![mcneese.chad](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/mcneese.chad/32/15056_2.png) [@mcneese.chad](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/mcneese.chad)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 3:45pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/29 "2018-10-25T15:45:11Z")
Overall, I think they do a good job of replacing faulty products, but I have seen some difficulties posted as well (just the same with about every MFGR). The bigger problem I see is continued sales of questionable designs like the metal over plastic drum on the wheel-on trainers. Those frequently develop a loud noise that they either replace or people use super glue to fix. That and another failure in the roller pressure mechanism that is fairly common. Tacx continues to make those exactly as they did in the beginning and have chosen not to make a proper fix via a design change. * * * We see increasing issues with the new “silent” Wahoo Kickr and Core. There is a design/mfg problem in the early batches. They have a fix that is in place on new production units and available directly to consumers with the what I call the “Clickr” issue via a kit or full unit replacement. They discovered an issue and employed a design change in effort to prevent it from happening in the future. That step is lacking in some existing Tacx products and still occur years after the faults are clear and known. That is poor practice from a MFGR, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Kuttermax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/kuttermax/32/101635_2.png) [@Kuttermax](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Kuttermax)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 3:50pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/30 "2018-10-25T15:50:21Z")
I have both the first gen Kickr and the Tacx Neo. I used the first gen Kickr for several years and really liked it. However there was a major issue in that the Kickr read consistently higher for power as opposed to my powermeters. I spoke with Wahoo on multiple occasions, but ultimately there was nothing that could be done. I then switched to a Tacx Neo. It has a slightly different road feel than the Kickr, but I wouldn’t see it’s better, both are great. If you Zwift, I’d image the extra feedback from the Neo would be cool but I’m not a Zwifter. Importantly it matches my Quarq power meter nearly dead on. It does have some flex/give and this is noticeable and does make it more forgiving and comfortable on longer sessions. The glowing light that changes color with intensity is cool but definitely not vital. I have a Trek Emonda that has a rear thru-axle and this is not included with Neo, so an added expense. I was able to use a coupon code at an online shop to get the Neo, so cost was pretty similar to the Kickr. The Kickr added the Climb this year, so perhaps that might be of interest to some, but not something I think I would use. Otherwise I think both are great trainers and will get the job done. From all reports, the new Kickrs are much more consistent with their power numbers as compared to the first gen model. ---
**Author:** ![mcneese.chad](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/mcneese.chad/32/15056_2.png) [@mcneese.chad](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/mcneese.chad)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 3:54pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/31 "2018-10-25T15:54:06Z")
> [@julianoliver](#): > > What can I expect in changing from a wheel on trainer (Snap) to a direct-drive (Kickr)? Wheel-off is nice because you don’t have to fret about tire pressure, roller pressure and such. Just calibrate after a 10 minute warm-up (similar to the Snap), and you are good to go for about 2 weeks on calibration (assuming you don’t unload/reload the bike on the trainer. No wheel slip or tire squeaking is also nice. The larger flywheel leads to better inertia and “road feel”, especially when riding/racing in sims like Zwift. Pretty much all good stuff, with a few possible exceptions. - The hassles come if you want to load different bikes with mismatched drivetrains (10s vs 11s) or axle standards (QR vs TA). - And you can sometimes have to adjust your rear derailleur barrel a bit to get smooth shifting. ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 6:17pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/32 "2018-10-25T18:17:32Z")
> [@mcneese.chad](#): > > The larger flywheel leads to better inertia and “road feel”, especially when riding/racing in sims like Zwift. @julianoliver As Chad and I discussed in another thread, you will want to play around with gearing to find proper road feel. I’m bigger and carry a lot of momentum outside and use something like 50x19 or 50x17 gearing. Lighter riders find the smaller chainring provides a more natural road feel. ---
**Author:** ![JT\_34](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/jt_34/32/123966_2.png) [@JT\_34](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/JT_34)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2018, 11:34pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/33 "2018-10-25T23:34:46Z")
I just got a Kickr Core this week because I figured I could save the 300 bucks between the regular Kickr and the Core. Had the extra required parts lying around so that wouldn’t add cost, plus many reviews said the Core was basically the same thing. Lets be honest I’m not doing 2000+ watt sprints so why bother… Getting it built up and ready to ride I was excited to try ERG mode. Warmed it up, did the spin down, and started a basic endurance TR workout. After about 10 min I thought to myself that it felt really easy. Kickr was showing 242 watts. So I turned on my Garmin and calibrated the Quarq to see I was actually only riding 208ish watts. Redo the spin down a couple of times doesn’t help. Hook the Quarq up with power smooth but I felt like the resistance was taking pretty long to adjust. Tried both bike, both with Quarqs, which were in line with each other. Yesterday I found the advance spin down, did that 3 times and still had the same problem. Then trying to take it out of erg mode while doing Geiger it kept putting it into erg mode which was super frustrating. I messaged Wahoo’s customer service about it and I got back a message today that was a copy and paste “this is why power meters are different”. Kinda said I was an idiot for not understanding drive train loss. Had to reply that I understand drive train loss, and if that was really the case the Kickr should be reading lower, not 35 watts higher then it should. 16% seems super excessive right? ---
**Author:** ![Kuttermax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/kuttermax/32/101635_2.png) [@Kuttermax](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Kuttermax)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 12:03am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/34 "2018-10-26T00:03:48Z")
I don’t have experience with the new Kickr’s, just the first gen one, but that sure sounds a lot like what happened with my first gen Kickr ie. high readings. I’d definitely push for a replacement unit and see if it has the same issues or not. Most reports seem to indicate the new Kickrs are pretty accurate in terms of power. ---
**Author:** ![JT\_34](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/jt_34/32/123966_2.png) [@JT\_34](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/JT_34)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 1:59am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/35 "2018-10-26T01:59:48Z")
Is that something I should push Wahoo to do or the shop I got it from? I mean I’ve only had it two days. ---
**Author:** ![Kuttermax](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/kuttermax/32/101635_2.png) [@Kuttermax](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Kuttermax)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 2:43am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/36 "2018-10-26T02:43:56Z")
Personally I’d talk to the shop first and see if they will just exchange it for you. I would think the shop would want to do right by you. Wahoo would then be forced to take the defective unit back from the shop. ---
**Author:** ![matthew.weigel](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/matthew.weigel/32/176_2.png) [@matthew.weigel](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/matthew.weigel)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 2:58am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/37 "2018-10-26T02:58:30Z")
I hate to be a broken record on these sorts of threads… but consider the STAC Zero Halcyon! - Seriously silent - Can be adjusted to work with different size wheels (not great for frequent switching between different size wheels though) - Folds flat for transport (I know, you say it’s a permanent set up) - If you did take it somewhere… it runs off a rechargeable battery so you can have a smart trainer without a power outlet - Uses a real strain gauge power meter, no calibration needed - But _can_ be calibrated to match your current power meter - $400 cheaper than the Kickr Yes you keep your wheel on, but it isn’t pressed against a roller for resistance (I got a dedicated wheel for mine, and didn’t even bother putting a tire on it for quite a while). ---
**Author:** ![bherbers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bherbers](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bherbers)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 2:01pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/38 "2018-10-26T14:01:20Z")
I have a Neo and don’t have any complaints about mine. The first one I bought was damaged in shipping (the box had a huge gash along the side) and the online retailer I bought it from replaced it with no issues. Since then it’s been smooth sailing. I chose the Neo because I lived in an apartment at the time and wanted the quietest possible trainer. I also wanted to be able to train in the same room as my GF while we watched TV at night. Never do Zwift so the road feel stuff never really made much of a difference to me, but I could see how it would be fun to have. The power meter accuracy and not needing calibration were definitely added bonuses. These trainers can last a long time, so I didn’t try to get too caught up on a couple hundred dollars either way. I’m pretty sure the Friction Facts guy has put literally over a million miles on his Neo and it still works. However, if I had to make the same decision today I would look a lot closer at the new, quieter KICKR models. ---
**Author:** ![Tezz](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/tezz/32/24009_2.png) [@Tezz](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Tezz)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 3:26pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/39 "2018-10-26T15:26:16Z")
I actually just watched this a few days ago. First I’ve heard of it. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/original/3X/a/3/a396ca19fc541e89749a44e4b0c2acc644e4cddc.jpeg "STAC Zero Halcyon Smart Trainer: Unboxing // Building // First Rides") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvzhHcONunc) ---
**Author:** ![julianoliver](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/julianoliver/32/229_2.png) [@julianoliver](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/julianoliver)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 3:38pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/40 "2018-10-26T15:38:25Z")
And a comprehensive (as always) write up from DC Rainmaker here: > **[Hands-on: STAC Zero Halcyon Smart (Totally Silent) Trainer](https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2018/05/hands-on-stac-zero-halcyon-smart-totally-silenttrainer.html)** > > Many of you have been eagerly awaiting my hands-on thoughts with the STAC Zero Smart Trainer, the first version from the company to allow resistance control from apps like Zwift and TrainerRoad.  The unique proposition of the STAC Zero trainers ---
**Author:** ![matthew.weigel](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/matthew.weigel/32/176_2.png) [@matthew.weigel](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/matthew.weigel)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 4:39pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/41 "2018-10-26T16:39:55Z")
Interesting watch from @gpl. I had a different installation experience, but I was previously using the base model and bought the upgrade unit - I didn’t have to screw on the actuators, but I had other trouble with aligning the new resistance unit. I can understand the fiddly nature of install turning people off, though. It’s easy to forget once I got the trainer set up and the sailing has been so smooth since. I was most surprised at his reaction when the trainer didn’t eliminate drivetrain noise on his bike. The trainer is not contributing any noise, and it’s quiet enough that I can train in the room next to my sleeping daughter just fine. It doesn’t silence my drive train, but it doesn’t silence my fan either. 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![Papuass](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/papuass/32/162_2.png) [@Papuass](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Papuass)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2018, 5:44pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482/42 "2018-10-26T17:44:47Z")
In case you have carbon wheels, you might need to purchase a cheap aluminum wheel, though, as it needs magnetic material. Might not be a huge problem as I have heard of people swapping wheels to use trainer tire for inside rides and proper one for outside. [Previous page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482.md?page=1) [Next page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/wahoo-kickr-or-tacx-neo-and-discussion-on-stac-zero-halcyon/4482.md?page=3)