# Riding into a headwind **URL:** \ **Category:** Training\ **Created:** [March 23, 2021, 9:07am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034 "2021-03-23T09:07:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![DaveWh](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/davewh/32/13120_2.png) [@DaveWh](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/DaveWh)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 6:37pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/42 "2021-03-23T18:37:24Z")
> [@Dr\_Alex\_Harrison](#): > > Riding into headwind disallows the repeated microaccelerations that would happen during normal pedaling I think the micro-accelerations are even less when riding fast on the road. IME, fast road vs steep climb are on opposite ends of the spectrum of ride feel. I do a lot of steep climbs. Not so much fast road. So fast road riding for me feels a lot harder vs climbing. ---
**Author:** ![DaveWh](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/davewh/32/13120_2.png) [@DaveWh](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/DaveWh)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 6:39pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/43 "2021-03-23T18:39:45Z")
When I’d hear Lance Armstrong talking about cross tail winds being the hardest conditions to ride in, it took me a while to figure out why. This article does a nice job explaining. ---
**Author:** ![Brennus](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/brennus/32/1318_2.png) [@Brennus](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Brennus)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 6:58pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/44 "2021-03-23T18:58:51Z")
> [@splash](#): > > Do others feel the same? Why is that? Only just about everybody, I bet! 😃 One thing I found out…when I turned into a headwind the first thing I’d do is get aero. Then I’d pedal along at the same power. Once I got on TR Coach Chad’s Evil Texting Imp taught me that I can’t ride in an aero pos’n at the same power as I can while sitting up on the hoods. That was the biggest thing for me. Same power in the aero pos’n is a bigger effort. On the other hand I hate working hard in a headwind on a hot day then absolutely roasting after the turnaround. One nice thing about a headwind is that it does keep you cooler. ---
**Author:** ![Shrike](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/shrike/32/17010_2.png) [@Shrike](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Shrike)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 7:00pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/45 "2021-03-23T19:00:42Z")
This turned out to be pretty interesting. I like this micro-acceleration resistance idea a lot. Think if you add that to the cauldron we’re pretty close to the suck factor equation. Would be interesting to see it tested, a rider all strapped up with sensors etc ---
**Author:** ![Brennus](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/brennus/32/1318_2.png) [@Brennus](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Brennus)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 7:01pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/46 "2021-03-23T19:01:18Z")
> [@Joelrivera](#): > > > [@bbarrera](#): > > > > simply do my 2 hours of z2 and not try and grab a KOM or PR. > > Whats the point of going out then! @Joelrivera that’s just bbarrera’s smokescreen for those rare rides when he actually doesn’t get a KOM or PR. ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 7:11pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/47 "2021-03-23T19:11:11Z")
You guys aren’t going to goad me into updating my unintentional KOM near the interval start. Unless some bozo steals it today now that it’s been converted from Sector 1 Pave into smooth tarmac 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![Cleanneon98](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/cleanneon98/32/80252_2.png) [@Cleanneon98](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Cleanneon98)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 7:15pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/48 "2021-03-23T19:15:35Z")
Don’t feel bad about getting a KOM in a tailwind sometimes. Unless you’re the guy I have driving around town with his TT bike in the trunk to take my KOMs but only when winds are 15+mph in his favor ---
**Author:** ![Joelrivera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/joelrivera/32/145557_2.png) [@Joelrivera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Joelrivera)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 7:17pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/49 "2021-03-23T19:17:13Z")
I usually never chase CR. But if winds are favorable and they are near my house I will try… 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Shrike](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/shrike/32/17010_2.png) [@Shrike](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Shrike)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 7:59pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/50 "2021-03-23T19:59:35Z")
Was looking at a KOM today, clicked the guys ride… average speed 24.5mph on a 110 mile loop! I was like wow fast dude, was expecting the KOM to be a mad tailwind, but he has KOMs all over the loop. Then I saw the comments… he was motorpacing! And quite proud of it too. The TT guys though… fair play to them. We just can’t compete. If you get a crazy TT’er who can handle strong tailwinds they will blow everything apart. I’m not experienced on a TT bike and have had to sell mine last year as I had no time - but I was always nervy on it. Much respect to guys who can hold TT position in winds many roadies are scared of… We should all be in different ride types I think, but not enough TT’ers for them to buy into it. ---
**Author:** ![Cleanneon98](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/cleanneon98/32/80252_2.png) [@Cleanneon98](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Cleanneon98)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 8:04pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/51 "2021-03-23T20:04:08Z")
That’s a perfect candidate to flag and report to strava. Look up Joe Lawhorn #593 on Strava he does some legit amazing TT rides without a car ---
**Author:** ![Shrike](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/shrike/32/17010_2.png) [@Shrike](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Shrike)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 8:07pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/52 "2021-03-23T20:07:11Z")
Jeez, this guy is a beast… ![Screenshot 2021-03-23 at 20.06.51](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/original/3X/4/e/4e4b9c28ed512de2e69982ad656fdb2df0778aab.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Cleanneon98](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/cleanneon98/32/80252_2.png) [@Cleanneon98](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Cleanneon98)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 8:09pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/53 "2021-03-23T20:09:04Z")
Yea and since maybe I’m derailing the thread a bit, I’ll say he definitely rides into headwinds as he is outdoors every day no matter what the conditions are, blizzards included. Those Marines are tough ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 9:07pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/54 "2021-03-23T21:07:58Z")
Back on topic… > [@splash](#): > > I still think there is a difference between climbing and headwinds. I feel I can put out good power on a climb, but not into a headwind. A lot of speculation on reasons, some sound like excuses and only a few are actionable. Here is what I propose: - if you ride the hoods while climbing, use the exact same riding position while battling a headwind in order to eliminate body position as a possible issue - yes that means you’ll need to swallow your pride and ignore the speed on your bike computer - go into the wind with proper attitude, and don’t mentally give yourself permission to underachieve into a headwind Try that on a couple of rides and see if it makes a difference on ability to put out power. ---
**Author:** ![splash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ac8455/32.png) [@splash](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/splash)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 9:12pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/55 "2021-03-23T21:12:16Z")
Thats not the same position as when climbing, because of the weight shift due to the bike being on a gradient. ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 9:15pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/56 "2021-03-23T21:15:18Z")
Don’t argue minor details, the point is to replicate the body position as much as possible. I’m not some freak just because I can put out the same smooth power on flats or climbs, at 90rpm or 45rpm, headwind or tailwind. Its a skill and there is a mental component. ---
**Author:** ![splash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ac8455/32.png) [@splash](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/splash)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 9:44pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/57 "2021-03-23T21:44:31Z")
No, I think the body position difference is important, as is the inertia/torque component. I do think the magnitude of it is individual, it would have to do with body mechanics, for example leg length or shift in centre of gravity. For some people, it might come natural, but for others, it definitvely does not. Just look at the replies in this thread. I do agree that there is probably a skill to it, and what exactly that is was part of the reason I started this thread. Nobody is denying that there is a mental component, but we all know that and it’s not of interest to me. ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 10:55pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/58 "2021-03-23T22:55:41Z")
Saying ‘it’s not of interest to me’ sounds like you are giving the mental component a pass 🤷‍♂️ We have windy Strava segments affectionately named #strugcity and Gale Force Sprint for a reason - the wind is howling and you can barely hear anything, you are putting out threshold power, the gusts will make you go well over threshold in an effort to keep speed constant, riding in an echelon is a struggle for survival, your speed is 13-15mph solo instead of 20-24mph, the out-of-area guys/gals are mentally giving up and dropping off the back, etc., etc. So I have a few questions after re-scanning your posts: 1. Your local ‘climbs last a few minutes’ and you can ‘ride into the wind for hours’ - should I take [what you wrote](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/17) literally and you are comparing a few minutes climbing to riding in to the wind for hours? 2. In the original post, you mentioned keeping the same position (eg in a TT) the headwind feels harder but in the preceding sentence you said climbs you open up more and headwind you get more aero. Have you ever tried mimicking a climbing position (e.g. hands on bars) while battling a headwind for a couple of minutes and confirm you can put out the same power? 3. Any data on HR? Sorry if I’m misinterpreting your posts, however my original skimming of your posts led me to believe you are: - doing much longer headwind efforts in a TT position - doing short 1-3 minute climbs in a more open (non-aero) position and then trying to compare two dissimilar efforts. Personally I’ve found 1 hour climbs and 1 hour headwind rides to be more similar than different. On those hard 85-95% FTP efforts, I’ve never noticed ‘muscle activation’ to be an issue, instead it has always come down to muscular endurance (strength endurance). I’m often undergeared on climbs, and so I practice that on the flats into a headwind. Now punchy 1-3 minute climbs are a different matter, thats all about being able to go way above FTP which is something I practice on the flats (1-3 minute over FTP intervals) and those transfer nicely to short punchy climbs. ---
**Author:** ![splash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ac8455/32.png) [@splash](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/splash)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 7:08am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/59 "2021-03-24T07:08:06Z")
I was just trying to have a debate on the physics of riding into a headwind… ---
**Author:** ![Anna\_K](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/anna_k/32/61466_2.png) [@Anna\_K](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Anna_K)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 7:49am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/60 "2021-03-24T07:49:50Z")
> [@bbarrera](#): > > Personally I’ve found 1 hour climbs and 1 hour headwind rides to be more similar than different. I think this is really a personal thing. You are one of those people who don’t lose power into a headwind, others (like splash and myself) do. And no, it’s not because a 30min headwind section is longer than a 3min climb (surprise 😃 ), and no, it’s not because I’m ashamed of going “slow”, and no it’s not because I’m not used to riding in a CdA \<0.18 position. I do find it interesting how much the effect is different for people and what the potential reasons might be (biomechanics, breathing). Fwiw I also lose a lot of power on the turbo. ---
**Author:** ![Shrike](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/shrike/32/17010_2.png) [@Shrike](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Shrike)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 8:06am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034/61 "2021-03-24T08:06:50Z")
I’m going to try replicating a more climbing position this week into strong headwinds, and mentally tell myself I’m on a climb. Actually treat it like one. Physically can’t totally match or activate the same muscles of course, but might be able to undo one element of the suck factor… worth a try, not doing much else other than being blown around for hours anyway! [Previous page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034.md?page=2) [Next page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/riding-into-a-headwind/56034.md?page=4)