Its a sad day to be an American

I don’t think specific ideology matters for would be dictators. The formula has been shockingly simple:

  1. Tell people what they want to hear. Tell them that everyone else is lying to them.
  2. Blame “the other” for everything
  3. Find media outlets (new and old) that will go along with you
  4. Once people trust you about things they already believed, you can lie to them about anything.

I don’t think most people understand how a mostly honest media is a key element of a democracy. Look at how Yellow Journalism contributed to the Spanish-American War to see what can happen when the media really goes off the rails.

Social media has removed any sort of gate keeper, so “honest media” became “social media”. That’s starting to change and it is going to be interesting to see how the pendulum swings on “Big Tech”.

6 Likes

I guess this point is the most frightening.

I moved out of the US several years ago and have no desire to return.
Many in this thread have referred to freedom in the US. The Patriot Act rescinded those freedoms many years ago. And the aftermath of the capitol intrusion is a rush by big tech to essentially remove all contrary opinions from their sites. The US will be more divided than ever as neither side will even be aware of what the other thinks, believes, and more importantly feels. Dialogue is the only sane way to resolve differences.
One of the biggest reasons I do not enjoy living in the US is that nearly its entire population tacitly approves of its overseas wars and blindly supports its military. Dialogue has never been important when you carry the bigger stick.

2 Likes

When you truly and honestly attempt to have a CIVIL conversation and are met with “it has been proven time & time again, there is no debating with liberals.”

Does it really matter if the “other side” is aware of what I think, believe or feel?

P.S. I am an independent but apparently got labeled as a liberal because I attempted to have a conversation with a conservative.

2 Likes

Contrary opinion would be:
Me: Blue is the best color
You: red is the best color.

Not a contrary opinion:
Me: The election was fair and there is no voter fraud.
You: There is massive election fraud lets invade the capitol!

I agree. Sadly sides want to dialog ONLY when they are on a losing position. And that will never change. (although one side SEEMS to be worse than the other)

I think it’s simpler than that. I think it’s just the cult psychology. Fascism or any other ideologies have little to do with it.

Not all of us. I personally believe that with very few notable exceptions, the acts of our military and intelligence community overseas have generally been to the detriment of the rest of human civilization.

3 Likes

Nothing in particular, I just want to drop this here.

2 Likes

I would argue that the conversation should not be the following:

Me. the election was fair and there is no voter fraud.
You: there is massive election fraud.
Me: what is your evidence?
You: Look at this video, this post, etc
Bigtech: there is no evidence of voter fraud so we are blocking access to your video, your posts, etc.
Me: bigtech blocked your links, etc and claims they are unsubstantiated so clearly there was no fraud.
You: since big tech is hiding it, of course there is election fraud.

My point is that one should be able to view the other’s point of view and/or their evidence in order to make up their own mind.
In the lead up to the Iraq war, Americans were led to believe Sadaam had weapons of mass destruction and most believed the narrative. Those of us who dug a bit deeper realized that the story was false based upon the inspectors who had been in Iraq who pointed out that it was impossible to prove a negative. In today’s world bigtech would have blocked access to any information that did not confirm the government’s narrative.

------ In today’s world bigtech would have blocked access to any information that did not confirm the government’s narrative.-------

You have no evidence to support that last statement above.

And the cause of war has been even simpler - fear of losing power. Look around global history, the fear of losing power drives those in power to manipulate the population such that they maintain power. It doesn’t seem to matter what the mode or cost is, as long as they stay in power.

Not only is he in fear of losing power, he is in fear of losing his wealth and perhaps his freedom.

1 Like

Just following up on my self, @Captain_Doughnutman this might work for you?

1 Like

You are correct; I should have said bigtech could have blocked access

Thanks! Will read when time allows.

In the end, it’s more than a bit unnerving that such a large portion of the population (10%?) has such a loose grip on their own minds that they could be swayed to such an extreme.

Of course we are all swayed to some degree, but buying Brand X instead of Brand Z is a far cry from activating as a domestic terrorist.

1 Like

The power they have is scary as ****. For 4 years there was always talk about ¨guardrails and safeguards of democarcy¨. Norms, rules, Investigations, impeachment. None of it put even a dent in Trumps efforts to destroy democracy. Now a handful of CEOs within 24 hours, might have stripped his powers in a very significant way. Not that I disagree with this particular decision. And honestly social media purging ISIS accounts might have done more in terms of fighting terrorism than any military campaign. (which, again is scary AF).
And the real scary thing is, these are global companies with the same amount of power in pretty much every country on earth with literally no oversight. They call the US president ¨the most powerful person on the planet¨. I think it’s Zuckerberg and Dorsey.

Yes and no. If you look at it in terms of the extreme only and believe all want to go to that level, then yes, a fair point.

But, if you step back and do a rational analysis, IMO, it is more equatable to religion. A large % of the population of Eatth believe in something. Something without proof, which is why it’s faith based. But also not all of them are extremists.

In my mind, Trump is their Jesus. That’s why sane discussion can’t be had. Not all are educated enough to debate and discuss. Many just believe.

They believe because they need to believe. They don’t have a plan B.

They really haven’t…he has the loudest microphone and largest pulpit in the world. All he has to do is walk down the hallway and there is literally a roomful of reporters and cameras waiting to broadcast what he says. He can appear on literally any news network almost at will (certainly true of FOX and OANN, but no way CNN turns down an interview / call-in).

And anything he says in those settings will be immediately tweeted and rebroadcast across multiple platforms.

5 Likes

Officially impeached…10 GOP members of the House cross the aisle and do their civic duty.

image

6 Likes

Fair enough.

On a sidenote: I do have to wonder how Fox news viewers square that in their head. If I recall correctly, Fox news was the first network to call the Election for Biden, and five minutes later the same network tells them it was all a fraud. Must be weird to live in that world .