All good.
I think to compensate for the ~30w increase in my power outdoors I’d actually have to increase the indoor workout by 30%… 
Hopefully lonestarcyclist can shed some light…
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Hey @robertbb apologies if I caused any confusion. There is not a direct software feature attached to this, however there are a couple of ways to do this depending on your use case.
If you want to utilize a TR workout outdoors with higher FTP I go into settings and adjust my FTP to my outdoor FTP prior to inputting the workout onto my head unit or phone so that the workout power goals match my outdoor FTP.
If you want the TSS to be more accurate for your outdoor rides you can, if you have a Wahoo (I am sure Garmin or other head units have the same feature but I use Wahoo), set your FTP for your outdoor ride and have a representation of TSS from your perceived outdoor FTP. Another way to do this with TR is to go online and go to your past outdoor workout. There you can edit the ride and adjust your FTP to your outdoor FTP and the TSS will adjust to reflect this.
I would also add that you do not need to compensate for the difference by bumping up your indoor FTP. Your indoor FTP is representative of indoor conditions (cooling, ambient temp, motivation etc, etc. for these reasons I always train indoors at my reflected TR FTP Tests) but if you feel there is a difference in outdoor FTP and want to represent that in outdoor workouts or TSS garnered outdoors, I recommend my previous steps.
I wish it was simpler or a software feature to toggle between indoor and outdoor FTP but with a few steps you can work around the settings.
Hope this helps and please ask more questions if this does not clarify! (The TR Feature I mentioned in the earlier post was the new ability to edit past ride FTPs to have it reflect a more accurate TSS for your training load)
Hi,
new to the forum. I run a Kickr 2 and a stages Gen 2 power meter. Interesting to me, I find that my Stages reads 30w lower than my Kickr 2 indoors. However on an outdoor ride my sustained hour power on my Stages Gen2 is identical to my indoor Kickr 2 FTP.
Any ideas and tips here?
Cheers
Jon
Usually outisde efforts are accomplished easier than the ones done indoor. So if you try to do an effort outside and your stages has a lower reading than your kickr, most likely the “outside” factor will help override the difference in power reading.
Thanks for clarifying - yeah, I just thought it was a simple as a software feature that allowed a different FTP to be maintained for indoor/outdoor rides.
I personally just use the same FTP for all rides, and understand that my TSS is always going to be higher on outdoor rides (compared to an indoor ride of the same duration).
There’s enough of an issue with the way that TSS/CTL/ATL/TSB are calculated anyway that the overall trend is far more useful than the minutiae of the detail.
Yeah to be honest I use my indoor ftp on the kickr2, as my outdoor and never find I blow up. I do think you’re right though in regards to outdoors feeling easier, as I don’t have good cooling indoors.
I just don’t understand how my stages is so much lower indoors than the kick, but is identical to kickr2 zones outdoors.
Before a trip to home country, I measured my FTP for the last time using PowerTap P1 on a Lemond Revolution. Did the ramp test. Scored 256W. Went home for 3 weeks and trained pretty hard. Felt that I had got stronger. On arrival back where I live, I got sick and stayed off the bike for 2 weeks. Probably the high TSS. Also at this point, I purchased a Kickr2018.
Did some workouts to get back into things but my HR was through the roof so took it easy for a bit. Finally did a ramp test and was disappointed to see my FTP drop to 239W (albeit using the new Kickr). Spent two weeks training for a 2 hour enduro at this using the crit speciality plan. This turned out to be an NP buster for the 2 hours. Figured my FTP must be wrong. Took Mon, Tue off, road easy on Wed and hit the ramp test on Thursday but could only force out 243W.
Decided to do SufferFest Full Frontal on Saturday (today) so rested Friday. When I did the test this time though, I recorded both devices separately. One of the SF app using the Kickr and then one on my Wahoo Bolt using my P1 Pedals. Result… 245W (wow, ramp test is close after all) on the Kickr and 271W on the P1 pedals. That’s a difference of 26W.
Perhaps more interestingly, here are the other numbers and the differences.
Titles: 5s 1m 5m 20m
Kickr2018: 808 299 293 245
PowrTapP1: 873 439 328 271
DiffersBY: 65 40 35 26
Not sure how to get a table to work but hopefully the above is formatted decently… Seems like the higher the number, it larger the discrepancy.
Incidentally, my P1 pedals are less than perfect. Only my left pedal records power right now as my right seems to have drowned after riding in really heavy rain 
This also seems to mean that they no longer zero. It always fails. Unfortunately, they are not out of warranty 
So not sure which measuring stick to believe, Kickr or P1 wrt to my FTP… If the P1 number is to be believed, then it means I have finally hit 4w/kg! I was 2.4w/kg this time last year (little heavier also). I want to believe that number 
as that my goal this year was to try to hit the big 4 
Thinking of setting my Kickr up so that it uses the PowerTap P1 measurement though. At least this way, TSS inside and out are matching.
TRUST your P1 pedals !
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Haha. Yes I must trust them. I configured the kickr to use them as a power source already and stuck in my new ftp 
seems to work well. Did taku this morning.
I have Pioneer dual leg PM and Tacx Neo. Without Powermatch, my PM was always is reading 20-30watts below especially over certain power limit. Once I switched to Powermatch, all my problems solved.
Additionally, 2 weeks back I took Ramp Test with Powermatch enabled and my FTP went down 12Watts. It was simply impossible to hit to target power. Then I took same test with ERG Mode enabled and I gained 16Watts back
I trained with ERG mode whole last year and I felt much much stronger outside. This year I gave a try to Powermatch and I dont like it :). I returned back to ERG
By the way, I agree with the quote that 300Watts on Tacx Neo is much much harder than outside.
Good luck
Why/how is activating this mode in the Wahoo app any different/better than the TrainerRoad Powermatch?
Isn’t powermatch meant to be used in ERG mode?
Yes.
I’ve just started using a powermeter on my road bike and Trainerroad.
Unfortunately, I only get to use my road bike for 50% of the time, the other 50% of time I get to use 2 different Wattbikes in two different gyms - my life is such that I use my road bike for 3 weeks in a row, then I use 1 wattbike for 1 week, then I use the other wattbike for 2 weeks in a row (- just due to work locations)
When I use Trainerroad at home, my turbo is set up outside in an open sided barn. The temperature varies with ambient conditions.
The 2 wattbikes I use are in two different gyms - i have no/little control over the ambient temperature position of the fans/HVAC ducting.
The above gives me a real problem with gaining any consistency which is what I was trying to address with the powermeter and Trainerroad.
Specifically.
I did an FTP test on my road bike on the turbo (in the barn) at start of October, I got 304W (HR: 151/154 bpm) - felt hard, small puddle/dampness around bike/floor.
I did an FTP test on Wattbike in one of my gyms (that I use ~16% of time) and managed 280W (I only did the first of 8min intervals - HR: 155 bpm/- bpm). Felt very hard, a veritable lake of sweat.
8% difference between two sets of FTP tests. My subsequent sessions I did at 94% of FT conditions - and the sessions were starting to feel do-able again.
On my road bike set-up in my barn.
I did Baxter last week, NP 203W at av HR 127bpm. Workout - felt okay. (warm ambient conditions for the season)
I repeated it yesterday NP 209W, HR 114bpm (cold ambient conditions, first blast of winter) - felt very easy.
My conclusion is that ambient conditions has a huge effect upon myself (I’m 185cm, 88-90kg - so maybe it affects larger people more that smaller - lower surface area per unit mass??).
The variations in FTP on each of the set-ups (and on my road bike due to natural seasonal, ambient temperature changes) means that attaining “consistency of training” is going to be very difficult. An “easy, endurance session” on the wattbike set-up using my road bike (on turbo) FTP can be near impossible (it may be a case of increasing my mental fortitude a bit).
My question to the forum.
Anyone else in similar scenario and what do you do to gain consistency? (I cannot move the turbo in the house - the Big Boss (the wife) won’t allow it - I cannot change the gyms’ facilities)
Should I do an FTP test every time I change machines, ie 3 times in every 6 weeks block - to determine my effective training powers for that week.
If I do an FTP test at least every 3 weeks (and more often for roadbike - as FTP appears strongly affected by ambient conditions) , which protocol is best to utilise - ultimately I’m training for Half Iron Distance racing - I’m currently using the 2x8mins FTP test.
I want to achieve consistency, as the Holy Grail of training, my life doesn’t allow it. I want to improve on my current situation of having an FTP and then having to adjust by an arbitrary amount to either be able to finish a workout (which would have been near impossibly hard) or to make a workout feel worthwhile (ie be just able to finish a “hard” session)
Any thoughts, greater appreciated.
I feel like it tracks better an dis more responsive than using PowerMatch. I’m able to use power smoothing and find that my power numbers are very, very close to accurate. I personally prefer power smoothing because I don’t have to focus SO closely on my numbers, and using ANT+ Control with Power Smoothing gives me the best balance.
The FTP test is recommended only every 4-6 weeks, because resting for it interferes with training and the difference between shorter time-frames will not be significant.
Also, the 8 min protocol for FTP may overestimate your true FTP. The TR ramp test, the twenty minute protocol, or a sixty minute protocol may provide more accurate results.
Thanks for the response Steve.
Whilst the 8min test may not be the best, I used it consistently between the set-ups, so hopefully any inaccuracy in the test in determining my FTP is the same for both set-ups, so I don’t believe the test protocol is the reason.
As an example of the differences, on 13/11 I attempted Tunnabora on the Wattbike in the gym, at a FTP of 265W. I bombed out after the 3rd of 5 intervals. Segment Sweet Spot. 14, I averaged 246W (target 249W) with a HR of 152bpm
The next day, I attempted Tunnabora on my roadbike/turbo set-up (in the barn) at an FTP of 304W. I completed the workout. Segment Sweet Spot 14, I averaged 315W (target 285W) with a HR of 149bpm.
The rest of the sessions I’ve been doing on my roadbike/turbo/barn set-up, all at 304W (FTP) have been completed (above predicted TSS), with generally lowish HR.
It seems fairly clear to me that the ambient conditions have a massive effect upon my performance sufficient for me to doubt the quality of the training.
Anyone else suffer with this problem? Any advice (other than to go off of RPE)?