# Estimated VO2 Max **URL:** \ **Category:** Training\ **Tags:** ramp-test\ **Created:** [October 1, 2018, 10:59pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080 "2018-10-01T22:59:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![apond58](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f9ae1b/32.png) [@apond58](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/apond58)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2019, 9:07pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/21 "2019-02-09T21:07:18Z")
My calculated results were pretty much bang on. A 2000m race for me was 6:33 at my best with body weight of 80 kg. Try entering your 6:30 or 7:00 mm:ss max cycling power in the calculator and check it again. The world record for the 2000m indoors is 5:35 and a good time is under 7:00. ---
**Author:** ![NArB](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/narb/32/12895_2.png) [@NArB](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/NArB)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2019, 9:32pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/22 "2019-02-09T21:32:20Z")
That put me just over 56. So now I have another number. 😂 More of a curiosity for me anyway. ---
**Author:** ![bigdaddynewt](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bigdaddynewt/32/13071_2.png) [@bigdaddynewt](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bigdaddynewt)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 8:40pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/23 "2019-02-12T20:40:15Z")
According to my recent test, that calculation was +/- 1 from the lab. 👍 ---
**Author:** ![Jonnyboy](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/jonnyboy/32/5802_2.png) [@Jonnyboy](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Jonnyboy)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 8:54pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/24 "2019-02-12T20:54:31Z")
> [@AndyGajda](#): > > Once you know your VO2 max, what are you going to do with it? Stay the hell away from it ---
**Author:** ![AndyGajda](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/andygajda/32/1052_2.png) [@AndyGajda](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/AndyGajda)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2019, 10:10pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/25 "2019-02-12T22:10:59Z")
😂 😂 😂 ---
**Author:** ![enric97](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/enric97/32/12890_2.png) [@enric97](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/enric97)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2019, 3:13pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/26 "2019-05-11T15:13:17Z")
My Garmin gives me a number of 73-74 VO2max, and I’m just average. I guess the real one could be around 50-60, my sister’s lab vo2max is 50 at 3.4w/kg. This number would be interesting to know the percentage of vo2max usage at treshold, My sister’s percentage it’s 87% which is cool (trained) but has little or no margin to increse ftp with that vo2max. I suppose at high percentages (near 90% and plateau), the way to be able to improve ftp is doing vo2max intervals so you have a little more margin to grow. Someone corrects me. ---
**Author:** ![hubcyclist](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/hubcyclist/32/14363_2.png) [@hubcyclist](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/hubcyclist)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2019, 6:12pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/27 "2019-10-01T18:12:19Z")
Apologies for resurrecting a long dead topic, felt better than starting a new one with not really a lot to question or add, just an observation since I’ve been running my garmin concurrently with trainerroad I’ve been doing some sweet spot workouts (antelope variants) and those seem to be triggering updated vo2 estimates. today I got 68 as my estimate after 5x10min @ 94% The number is about meaningless to me as far as something actionable, of course, but it’s fun to see a higher number I guess! ---
**Author:** ![Bioteknik](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bioteknik/32/7721_2.png) [@Bioteknik](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Bioteknik)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 10:44am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/28 "2019-10-03T10:44:55Z")
while the raw number itself is an estimate and can usually be a little higher than what a lab would determine, as long as it is going up is all the validation one needs to see how well training is going. Each device calculates it a little bit different, but basically any 20 minute block above 70% of max hr is used to determine the VO2 estimate. For it to be closer to the real number, you’d have to have a correct max HR input to your garmin device. For cycling it is Power:HR, and running Pace:HR. ---
**Author:** ![Marc\_Carter](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/marc_carter/32/622_2.png) [@Marc\_Carter](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Marc_Carter)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 2:45pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/29 "2019-10-03T14:45:28Z")
How long do VO2 numbers take to improve ? Mine really sucks and based on my Garmin its only improved about 6 points over the last 3 weeks on SSB1 mid vol. Maybe i’m expecting too much too soon ---
**Author:** ![Ivanecky](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/ivanecky/32/20890_2.png) [@Ivanecky](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Ivanecky)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 2:53pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/30 "2019-10-03T14:53:00Z")
Do you have cycling specific heart rate zones implemented in Garmin? ---
**Author:** ![Marc\_Carter](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/marc_carter/32/622_2.png) [@Marc\_Carter](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Marc_Carter)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 3:12pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/31 "2019-10-03T15:12:01Z")
On My device (520) i have it on auto detect so the max is in but not my resting HR ---
**Author:** ![RobertK](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/robertk/32/8539_2.png) [@RobertK](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/RobertK)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 4:21pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/32 "2019-10-03T16:21:40Z")
or try this (the ACSM formula that Coggan laid out in _TRWPM)_: do an evenly paced 4-5min effort look at the “flatline” watts – where the effort stabilizes and you’re not sprinting at the start or the end of the effort. watts x .0108 + mass in kg x .007 = liters of oxygen divide ml of oxygen by body mass recent 5 min effort: ![Untitled](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/original/3X/7/9/791b7f29f421f1a58d8b16f18830fa6039efed67.jpeg) 412 x .0108 = 4.4496 71 x .007 = .497 4.9466 liters of O2 4946 / 71 = 69.66 The Garmin VO2 estimator has me at 70, so, it’s in the ballpark (that’s also what the last lab test I had said). Take the estimates with a 5% grain of salt – but, lab tests can also have up to a 3% variance, depending the calibration and the competence of the tester, so there you go… The most important number is the race result – after that, are the watts going in the right direction on your training rides? ---
**Author:** ![RobertK](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/robertk/32/8539_2.png) [@RobertK](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/RobertK)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 7:15pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/34 "2019-10-03T19:15:48Z")
their VO2 estimate is tied to your best 20min aerobic effort, during a steady-paced ride – it goes off of Firstbeat research indexing HR to watts (I think it’s working off of % of HRR\* – like Seiler has referenced in podcasts, noting that if you are at 60% HRR, you are at 60% of VO2 max). If you do intervals, or you do a ride with chunks of HR zone 3, it won’t do a VO2 estimate. It works off of zone 1-2 HR rides, with steady effort, only. So you just go out and ride at your AeT and see what the Garminator says… \*HRR = Heart Rate Reserve. Max HR - Resting HR so for me: 171 - 45 = 126 126 x .6 = 75.6 75.6 + 45 = 121 60% of HRR = 121 ---
**Author:** ![hubcyclist](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/hubcyclist/32/14363_2.png) [@hubcyclist](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/hubcyclist)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 7:25pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/35 "2019-10-03T19:25:00Z")
> [@RobertK](#): > > If you do intervals, or you do a ride with chunks of HR zone 3, it won’t do a VO2 estimate. I did apple orchard today (15sec 125% 15-30sec 88% for 3.5mins each) and it triggered another vo2 estimate, 2nd time this week, went up to 69 today. I’m trying not to put too much brain power in understanding this stuff lol ---
**Author:** ![Bioteknik](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bioteknik/32/7721_2.png) [@Bioteknik](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Bioteknik)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2019, 10:30pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/37 "2019-10-03T22:30:47Z")
i think it is just 20 minutes without stopping, as long as it is above 70% of max HR (statement from my manual). 70% of max looks like it is almost the same as 60% of HRR ---
**Author:** ![devolikewhoa83](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/devolikewhoa83/32/7757_2.png) [@devolikewhoa83](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/devolikewhoa83)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 9:42pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/40 "2020-01-29T21:42:25Z")
Just to note, I have never found a FirstBeat whitepaper that actually explains their method. They describe how they validated it and what the results are, but there is never a “methodology” section like there ought to be in a published paper. So really hard to double-check their work. That said, I strongly suspect that the estimate depends on the FTP value that you input as well as the max HR value. Anecdotally, each time my Vo2max has gone up (according to Garmin) after a ride, my FTP estimate also has gone down. I used to think that the Garmin / FirstBeat method assumed a uniform level of efficiency among athletes. But I’m wondering they actually use FTp as a proxy for how efficient you are. ---
**Author:** ![devolikewhoa83](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/devolikewhoa83/32/7757_2.png) [@devolikewhoa83](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/devolikewhoa83)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 9:47pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/41 "2020-01-29T21:47:06Z")
also just to say it, these formulas are going to be kind of hard to apply if they ask for “Watts at Vo2max” because Vo2max has a time component, right? My understanding is taht there are a number of intensities that will eventually elicit Vo2max, just after different durations. So “power at Vo2max” doesn’t mean much without that time portion. Presumably this is why there are so many test protocols. ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 10:03pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/42 "2020-01-29T22:03:22Z")
> [@devolikewhoa83](#): > > Just to note, I have never found a FirstBeat whitepaper that actually explains their method. [https://www.firstbeat.com/en/aerobic-fitness-level-vo₂max-estimation-firstbeat-white-paper-2/](https://www.firstbeat.com/en/aerobic-fitness-level-vo%E2%82%82max-estimation-firstbeat-white-paper-2/) 3rd hit using “firstbeat vo2max estimation” in Duck Duck Go search engine. ---
**Author:** ![Un-QuittingBikes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/bb73d2/32.png) [@Un-QuittingBikes](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Un-QuittingBikes)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 10:03pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/43 "2020-01-29T22:03:28Z")
I like to use the formula 10.8 \* FTP / kg \* 0 + 200. ---
**Author:** ![devolikewhoa83](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/devolikewhoa83/32/7757_2.png) [@devolikewhoa83](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/devolikewhoa83)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2020, 10:08pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080/44 "2020-01-29T22:08:02Z")
This one I have seen. But it doesn’t really tell you how they do it, right? It just says “we extrapolate.” That can mean so many things. Unless I’m missing something, a FirstBeat-method Vo2max calculation is not reproducible from the above. That’s what I mean about them not explaining it. [Previous page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080.md?page=1) [Next page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/estimated-vo2-max/2080.md?page=3)