# Difference between aero and endurance road bikes **URL:** \ **Category:** Equipment\ **Tags:** bike\ **Created:** [June 2, 2019, 3:38am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648 "2019-06-02T03:38:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2020, 3:20pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/26 "2020-04-16T15:20:48Z")
50kph winds are tough for sure, but that doesn’t imply or say anything about yaw angle. ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2020, 5:06pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/28 "2020-04-16T17:06:25Z")
here is the article I was thinking about: > **[Real World Yaw Angles](https://www.slowtwitch.com/Tech/Real_World_Yaw_Angles_5844.html)** > > We routinely see wind tunnel data through a "sweep," that is, from a positive to negative yaw. But what yaws do we actually see in the real world of racing? give that a read. ---
**Author:** ![Power13](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/power13/32/92171_2.png) [@Power13](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Power13)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2020, 5:16pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/29 "2020-04-16T17:16:53Z")
Correct…and here is the full Mavic study that is referenced in the ST article. [http://engineerstalk.mavic.com/en/yaw-angle-measurement-in-real-conditions-on-kona-ironman-course/](http://engineerstalk.mavic.com/en/yaw-angle-measurement-in-real-conditions-on-kona-ironman-course/) I can’t get the graphs to load but see summary below: Kona (extreme crosswind conditions) - 70% of yaw angles are below +/- 10\* - Only 6% of yaw angles are above 20% Annecy, France (Low wind conditions) - 100% of yaw angles are below +/- 10\* - 82% are below +/- 4\* ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2020, 6:00pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/30 "2020-04-16T18:00:38Z")
good stuff ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2020, 6:11pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/32 "2020-04-16T18:11:44Z")
> [@simonicusfacilis](#): > > I also live on a west coast and spend most of my time tracking across the prevailing winds. So my probability of spending big chunks of time at big yaw angles on a given ride is 100%. yeah that Kona segment E in Mavic study looks familiar. I ride with a triathlete that has age group raced at Kona on and off since 2000. We’ve got heat but without the humidity, she says the wind is similar to Kona. ---
**Author:** ![robertbb](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/robertbb/32/1707_2.png) [@robertbb](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/robertbb)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 4:16am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/33 "2020-04-17T04:16:17Z")
Firstly, it is fact. Do some research. Secondly, I have no idea where you derived your implications from. The only implication, had you read what I said, is that position means everything. If the rider has to reach out with straight arms to ride an aero bike, the aero-ness of that bike is totally negated (as compared with a better position on an endurance bike). It makes absolutely zero sense to look at the aero-ness of a bike, without a rider. Just like it makes zero sense to count grams on a climbing bike, when those grams should be taken in context of bike AND rider weight combined. ---
**Author:** ![a59a2e9a2645dbb](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/a59a2e9a2645dbb/32/100578_2.png) [@a59a2e9a2645dbb](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/a59a2e9a2645dbb)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 4:19am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/34 "2020-04-17T04:19:04Z")
An aero road bike will make a difference if you’re riding off the front of crits and holding over 40km/h OR competing in the road bike TT class. Other than that it’s not going to make much of a difference. ---
**Author:** ![AJS914](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@AJS914](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/AJS914)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 4:56am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/35 "2020-04-17T04:56:25Z")
Aero always makes a difference. I don’t know why some people try to deny it. I see some guys in my club that do everything wrong aero-wise. They are leaving a tremendous amount of watts on the table and they are usually off the back. Here are some figures just off the top of my head from what I’ve read in the past. Before anyone nit-picks it apart, it is a ballpark estimate. We are talking group ride attack and sprint speeds aero road helmet… 10 watts tight race fit jersey and kit … 15 watts good aero positioning … 20 watts 50mm + deep aero wheels … 20 watts aero frame … 10 watts aero handlebar … 5 watts integrated cables … 3 watts total … 83 watts doing everything right If you have no aero game and you have a flappy jersey, or flappy wind jacket you are probably at a 100+ watt disadvantage. Even if you don’t buy an aero bike, you can still do all the other stuff on a relatively smaller budget and get most of the way there. My guess is that even in pace lines you might be saving 15-20+ watts. It’s not nothing. If your ftp is 200, you are saving 10% of your energy all day which makes you fresher for that last climb or last sprint into town. Now, if you don’t ride fast, you only ride alone, don’t do competitive group rides, and don’t race then forget about aero. ---
**Author:** ![BMAC615](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bmac615/32/13086_2.png) [@BMAC615](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/BMAC615)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 6:53am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/36 "2020-04-17T06:53:27Z")
Same size frame gives marginal benefits. 1. Are you racing? 2. Do you spend any significant amount time on or off the front? 3. Have you optimized everything else? If you answered yes to all of those, then it matters. If no to one or more, there are other areas to focus on. ---
**Author:** ![Power13](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/power13/32/92171_2.png) [@Power13](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Power13)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 1:06pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/37 "2020-04-17T13:06:09Z")
Settle down there, Sparky…don’t expect others to do the work to back up claims you make. My point, had you decided not to get your back up against the wall, was pretty clear. You are assuming that someone on an aero bike has vertical forearms and someone on an endurance bike has parallel forearms. An aero bike does not have to equate to vertical forearms nor does an endurance bike have to equate to parallel. Tailwinds. ---
**Author:** ![robertbb](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/robertbb/32/1707_2.png) [@robertbb](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/robertbb)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 1:16pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/38 "2020-04-17T13:16:48Z")
> [@Power13](#): > > You are assuming that someone on an aero bike has vertical forearms and someone on an endurance bike has parallel forearms. An aero bike does not have to equate to vertical forearms nor does an endurance bike have to equate to parallel. Only I never said that. And then I reminded you I never said that. Yet you remain fixated on something I never said. Cool. ---
**Author:** ![Power13](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/power13/32/92171_2.png) [@Power13](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Power13)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 1:25pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/39 "2020-04-17T13:25:58Z")
Whatever, my man…have a good day. ---
**Author:** ![BMAC615](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bmac615/32/13086_2.png) [@BMAC615](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/BMAC615)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 3:24pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/40 "2020-04-17T15:24:02Z")
Here’s an interesting take on the bar height body position dilemma [by a guy who knows about this stuff.](https://gerard.cc/2011/07/29/body-vs-bar-1/) ---
**Author:** ![stickmandj](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/stickmandj/32/146276_2.png) [@stickmandj](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/stickmandj)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 9:38pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/41 "2020-04-17T21:38:10Z")
All bikes are expensive now. In Canada, a similarly spec’d Madone SLR7 vs Domane SLR7 is only $350 more on a $10k bike. The Emonda SLR7 is a bit cheaper at $9600 I believe but still not a huge margin on a bike in that price range. I’m not sure how other manufacturers compare. Where I live its more flat and windy so an aero bike like the madone makes more sense than the emonda. As for the domane, I would rather pay the extra $350 for the madone and have the clean, aero look with it. But that’s just me. Interesting discussion!!! ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 10:16pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/42 "2020-04-17T22:16:29Z")
I’ve got a 2015 Domane (gen1) and would love to upgrade to Madone, need to kill this browser tab that has been hanging around for the last week or two: ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/original/3X/a/c/acf1edbf753c3c79f736499de4a5e1594b41fcb7.jpeg) List price in US for the two I’d consider - $4700 for the SL6 and $7000 for SLR6. But I’m cheap and will just keep on keeping on the Domane… maybe its time for another lottery ticket?! ---
**Author:** ![mcneese.chad](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/mcneese.chad/32/15056_2.png) [@mcneese.chad](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/mcneese.chad)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 10:23pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/43 "2020-04-17T22:23:54Z")
SL6 is a best of the buck in my eyes, bang for buck. Same shape and function, with a tad more weight than the SLR. The 7 would be nice for Di2, but not a necessity. The pending more aero Emonda could be worth a look, once we see the builds and pricing. ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 10:30pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/44 "2020-04-17T22:30:11Z")
I’m with you on bang for the buck. The manager at LBS got a 54cm 2020 Madone in Dec/Jan and can’t use his Stages PM due to clearance. Not sure if my crank would have the same issues on the 58cm. But I’m still trying to wear out my bike (the cheap thing) before finding out about Stages compatibility. Or come into a small pile of cash. ---
**Author:** ![Power13](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/power13/32/92171_2.png) [@Power13](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Power13)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 10:58pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/45 "2020-04-17T22:58:15Z")
All those options are a fail…not a single red bike. Pathetic. 😜 ---
**Author:** ![bbarrera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bbarrera/32/14734_2.png) [@bbarrera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bbarrera)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 11:16pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/46 "2020-04-17T23:16:40Z")
been rocking my wife’s old iPhone 6 since switching to Verizon after Thanksgiving (downgrade, long story, don’t ask), and woke up early and pre-ordered the new SE in (product)red… Couldn’t wait for the 5G phone to come out… So yeah, if I hit it big my top Project One color scheme choice is Gran Premio in Rage Red and Dnister Black. I kinda dig the Molten Marble but not sure if it would become passé after a year like the weird blue my neighbor got on a 6 series European delivery (he sold it 6 months later! what a waste). ---
**Author:** ![stickmandj](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/stickmandj/32/146276_2.png) [@stickmandj](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/stickmandj)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2020, 11:39pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648/47 "2020-04-17T23:39:49Z")
Nice colour choice! I agree about the molten marble. It’s a bit of a risk on something I plan on having for a while. I have been debating a madone slr7 for next year and the colours is something that I keep going back and forth on. Some nice options but it has to still look good to me 5 years from now. Mine also has to have red. [Previous page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648.md?page=1) [Next page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/difference-between-aero-and-endurance-road-bikes/16648.md?page=3)