# 2023 Specialized Allez **URL:** \ **Category:** Equipment\ **Tags:** bike\ **Created:** [May 23, 2023, 4:51pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005 "2023-05-23T16:51:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Joelrivera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/joelrivera/32/145557_2.png) [@Joelrivera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Joelrivera)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 5:36pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/48 "2023-05-24T17:36:11Z")
> [@mwglow15](#): > > So we’ll see if these companies try to keep their prices where they are now that their costs are coming down. Nothing… I can almost guarantee they will rather pocket the profits… ---
**Author:** ![mcneese.chad](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/mcneese.chad/32/15056_2.png) [@mcneese.chad](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/mcneese.chad)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 5:51pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/49 "2023-05-24T17:51:43Z")
Except that we are already seeing corrections happening as we speak: - [The big price war – Why brands are suddenly dropping prices to get rid of bikes and overstock is on everyone’s lips | ENDURO Mountainbike Magazine](https://enduro-mtb.com/en/big-price-war-why-brands-dropping-prices-bikes-overstock/) It’s almost impossible to find a regular bike company without sales on a one or more portions of their line right now. Many of the “sales” we see now are becoming the defacto “new MSRP” in some cases. It is the sign of a correction on the other side of the supply demand situation that got things so messed up in the beginning. I get the “_Big Bike = Bad_” mentality to a degree, but they are in a business and will be forced to follow reality. If people think that these companies are like other Phat Cat businesses with people in mansions all over the world drinking fine wine and smoking Cuba cigars… the reality is a fair bit different. These sales and other price corrections are the signs of companies are following what you mention above (_aka customers NOT buying stuff_), with these reductions as the incentive that sellers hope will be enough to bring in actual purchases. Modern economy at work. ---
**Author:** ![Topcat5](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/topcat5/32/119312_2.png) [@Topcat5](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Topcat5)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 6:52pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/50 "2023-05-24T18:52:17Z")
> [@lyarbro42](#): > > I don’t see what it isn’t to love for someone just getting started and not wanting to commit to one discipline. This is the gateway drug, if you will. I agree with this. Start with an entry bike and if you like the sport/hobby then make the next step. ---
**Author:** ![Power13](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/power13/32/92171_2.png) [@Power13](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Power13)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 8:42pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/51 "2023-05-24T20:42:21Z")
> [@Joelrivera](#): > > Now they are all blaming inflation (caused by all companies raising their prices and refusing to lower them) That isn’t really what causes inflation. But there is certainly a cascading effect to price increases….just work your way through the price chain. Raw material supplier raises their price to a component supplier. The component supplier takes the aggregate price increase from all of their raw material suppliers, rolls it into their price _plus their margin_. That component goes to a bike factory. Bike factory repeats the scenario as the components supplier, but magnified across all their component supplier so they raise their price _plus their margin_. Bike Supplier repeats the scenario when selling to the IBD who repeats the scenario again. Each step of the way, a small price increase from a raw material supplier is magnified as each step of the supply chain raises their prices plus…….wait for it……_their margin_. > [@Benjamin\_Reynolds](#): > > It looks like their net profit ratio is somewhere around 7-8%, so somewhere between average and low It should also be noted that this is the report for Giant as a factory, not Giant as a supplier. They are separate business models (and I believe, wholly separate companies). There is a reason factory owners and managers are driving Mercedes S500’s……that is where the real money (and power) resides. ---
**Author:** ![Joelrivera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/joelrivera/32/145557_2.png) [@Joelrivera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Joelrivera)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 8:48pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/52 "2023-05-24T20:48:49Z")
> [@Power13](#): > > That isn’t really what causes inflation. Yeah I know. Inflation is way more complicated. in a nutshell… People are asking to be paid more, companies are passing down the raises to consumers by making them pay more. Also, now people who are making more money and are willing to spend the money, so companies want a piece of the money too, so they will also increase the prices of their product in top of the extra they were asking to increase salaries. So now people are back at asking for more money. And we repeat until there is nothing left but destruction. Or something like it. ---
**Author:** ![Power13](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/power13/32/92171_2.png) [@Power13](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Power13)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 8:51pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/53 "2023-05-24T20:51:49Z")
Let me give you a real world example of how a price increase can grow exponentially down the supply chain. We are all aware of the tariffs installed by the former administration against some Chinese goods. These tariffs are generally 25%. One of those categories affected in medical thermometers (great timing for that right when a pandemic hit). as a result of the pandemic, the implementation of the tariffs has been postponed (now until this September). But let’s say my landed cost for a thermometer is $1.00. My new landed cost is $1.25. For simple math, let’s say we work with a 50% margin. So my price to my customers just went from $2.00 to $2.50. Now, let’s assume the retailer also works on a 50% margin. The retail price just went up from $4.00 to $5.00. So what was a $.25 increase to my landed cost ends up costing the consumer 4x as much as it costs me. Note - these above scenario / margins are fictitious for easy math. The actual numbers lead to an even higher price increase for consumers because retailers can be greedy AF on some products. You’d be horrified by how much margin they make on some of our products. 😵‍💫 ---
**Author:** ![Joelrivera](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/joelrivera/32/145557_2.png) [@Joelrivera](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Joelrivera)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 8:58pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/54 "2023-05-24T20:58:45Z")
> [@Power13](#): > > because retailers can be greedy AF Yeah… its a fuck-aton SOME People are getting pay more, retailer can ask for more money and make record profits and blame inflation and supply chains issues. ---
**Author:** ![JoeX](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/joex/32/6640_2.png) [@JoeX](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/JoeX)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 8:58pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/55 "2023-05-24T20:58:55Z")
[https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/road-bike-triban-rc-120-grey/\_/R-p-308062?mc=8554264](https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/road-bike-triban-rc-120-grey/_/R-p-308062?mc=8554264) Sorry, link didn’t work fixed now. A cheaper bike, as reliable, that isn’t a BSO. £349. £500 disc/Sora version. [https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/road-bike-triban-rc-500-disc-brake/\_/R-p-308097](https://www.decathlon.co.uk/p/road-bike-triban-rc-500-disc-brake/_/R-p-308097) ---
**Author:** ![Benjamin\_Reynolds](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/benjamin_reynolds/32/20651_2.png) [@Benjamin\_Reynolds](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Benjamin_Reynolds)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2023, 9:38pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/56 "2023-05-24T21:38:34Z")
I’m pretty sure what I linked and quoted is consolidated earnings for the parent company So that would include both manufacturing and sales of bicycles. Those are both separate companies, but it would appear to me they consolidate up. They break it all down by company in the report as you read through it. It’s very interesting imo. I know most people can’t be bothered to read financials, but I find them very interesting to really grasp what the economic realities are for various industries. I particularly like reading the financial reports for various local governments in my area. ---
**Author:** ![enki42](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/enki42/32/68042_2.png) [@enki42](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/enki42)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2023, 1:43am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/57 "2023-05-25T01:43:33Z")
> [@jz91](#): > > On this budget discs add a ton of weight that is not needed really but that’s my opinion. On this budget: - you won’t be getting a weight weenie bike anyway so a few extra grams isn’t going to matter much. -They aren’t going to waste money producing two different frames and have more models to try and stock ---
**Author:** ![jz91](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/53a042/32.png) [@jz91](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/jz91)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2023, 3:51am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/58 "2023-05-25T03:51:04Z")
> [@enki42](#): > > so a few extra grams I’d say it’s quite a lot more than a few grams…add that on a bike that is already heavy and you suck all the fun out of the ride. But yeah I mean whatever…I’d say though that if consumers were more informed at the moment of purchase things might have gone down differently. Especially those buying their first bike might just trust what the guy at the store says and buy into the whole narrative that disc brakes are better…only add a few grams etc etc without having actual knowledge on the difference between the two systems. Does one really need discs on an entry level commuter bike? 🤷 I know my answer but we’re all different. Also, I’ve also noticed they use a mechanical disc brake system on one version… 😁 I’d be curious to try that. If the argument is that it’s cheaper for the manufacturer then I fully agree. Is this a good thing for the consumer? 🫤 ---
**Author:** ![bmcd](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bmcd/32/20016_2.png) [@bmcd](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bmcd)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2023, 4:22am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/59 "2023-05-25T04:22:13Z")
Could you even buy a decent spec aluminium bike two years ago (peak Covid)? ---
**Author:** ![jz91](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/53a042/32.png) [@jz91](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/jz91)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2023, 10:53am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/61 "2023-05-25T10:53:45Z")
[Gc review](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OZ2yDRJ-VLY) Out of interest 10.3kgs (so 9.9kgs without pedals maybe) 🫢 😳 Yep quite a few extra grams… ---
**Author:** ![Benjamin\_Reynolds](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/benjamin_reynolds/32/20651_2.png) [@Benjamin\_Reynolds](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Benjamin_Reynolds)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2023, 12:45pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/62 "2023-05-25T12:45:03Z")
I for one love to see disc brakes on a bike like this. Let’s be honest, even if it added 5 lbs to the bike, for most folks this is going to make fudge all difference in average speeds. Most of us on this forum could probably lose that in body weight let alone the folks just getting into the sport. The benefits of disc though I think are immense. The rim brake bikes all topped out at 25mm or maybe 28mm tires. This is fine for pure road riding on the smoothest of surfaces. However, these disc brake bikes usually fit 35mm tires and are also typically shipped with tubeless compatible wheels. This is HUGE, because it means this bike is actually a decent option for someone who wants to ride on multi-use paths that are often either very bumpy asphalt or crushed limestone. For me, disc brakes vs rim brakes really isn’t about the weight or braking performance. It’s more about the fact that disc brakes open you up to much nicer tire and wheel options. Which in turn allows the bike to be used on a variety of surfaces and makes the entire package significantly more useful. ---
**Author:** ![Power13](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/power13/32/92171_2.png) [@Power13](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/Power13)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2023, 12:56pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/63 "2023-05-25T12:56:07Z")
> [@jz91](#): > > Does one really need discs on an entry level commuter bike? “need” and “want” are not the same thing…again, the market decided a long time ago that rim brakes were dead. ---
**Author:** ![mcneese.chad](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/mcneese.chad/32/15056_2.png) [@mcneese.chad](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/mcneese.chad)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2023, 2:34pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/64 "2023-05-25T14:34:29Z")
Some good discussion about the bike and market: - [Geek Warning: Good entry-level aluminum bikes are rad • Escape Collective - Podcast Addict](https://podcastaddict.com/escape-collective/episode/158198657) ---
**Author:** ![bmcd](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/bmcd/32/20016_2.png) [@bmcd](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/bmcd)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 8:50am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/65 "2023-05-26T08:50:56Z")
Yeah maybe, I’m not disagreeing and TBH I don’t understand the nostalgia for ‘good’ alu frames. But, looking at a 2020 price list a CAAD13 105 Disc retailed for $3,199 vs $2500 for the (Tiagra) Allez tested (AUD prices). ---
**Author:** ![enki42](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/enki42/32/68042_2.png) [@enki42](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/enki42)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2023, 7:04pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/66 "2023-05-29T19:04:51Z")
> [@jz91](#): > > I’d say it’s quite a lot more than a few grams…add that on a bike that is already heavy and you suck all the fun out of the ride. > **[Bike Calculator](http://bikecalculator.com/)** > > Useful calculators for estimating your speed on a bicycle velocity from various parameters. So this bike is 10.3 as above. Using 10% grade for a steep climb and the rest at default (150 watts, 70kg rider…) 10.3kg bike is 6.16km/hr and a 5kg bike is 6.58km/hr. At 3% grade, 16.01km/hr vs 16.75km/hr So much slower… And that is for a 5.4kg difference in weight and I’m sure disc brakes aren’t half the bike weight. I mean this makes it seem like its under 100g from rim to disc for 105: > **[2020 Road & Gravel Groupset Weight Comparison](https://ccache.cc/en-us/blogs/newsroom/2020-road-gravel-groupset-weight-comparison)** > > Updated May-2020 > > Crankset weights will vary depending on size and length. > Cassettes are 11-28 (or closest) > We've removed bottom bracket weight as these are frame dependant.  > Note: SRAM eTap component weights includes batteries because... At 0.5kg weight decrease going to rim from 10.3 kg (so more realistic) at 10% grade the speed is 6.20km/hr (0.04km/hr faster) and at 3% the speed is 16.08km/hr (0.07km/hr faster) > [@jz91](#): > > Especially those buying their first bike might just trust what the guy at the store says and buy into the whole narrative about how weight so so important? As you can see from the math above, is 0.05km/hr speed loss while climbing sucking the fun out of biking? Actual knowledge of the real impact of the weight difference is useful if you’re going to claim weight is so very important. This isn’t even bothering to factor in the advantages @Benjamin_Reynolds makes ---
**Author:** ![rocourteau](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/rocourteau/32/7746_2.png) [@rocourteau](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/rocourteau)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2023, 7:38pm UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/67 "2023-05-29T19:38:08Z")
At this point, the manufacturers are not going to build and push rim brake versions distributors don’t want, the distis won’t buy and stock rim brake versions retailers don’t want, and the retailers won’t buy and stock rim brake versions customers don’t want. 100g, 500g or 1500g weight difference won’t change a thing. It won’t sell. Disc brakes are dial tone now. ---
**Author:** ![rhorn](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/trainerroad/forum/user_avatar/www.trainerroad.com/rhorn/32/12890_2.png) [@rhorn](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/u/rhorn)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2023, 8:04am UTC](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005/68 "2023-05-31T08:04:14Z")
> For me, disc brakes vs rim brakes really isn’t about the weight or braking performance. It’s more about the fact that disc brakes open you up to much nicer tire and wheel options. Those options were already available with cantilever brakes - I have an old dolan fitted with (TRP CX9) canti’s that can stop the bike no problem going down hill with a 45kg trailer behind it, in fact every bit as well as my Surly with GRX hydro discs. I guess that canti brakes are seen as old school and “touring” rather than cool and “gravel” though [Previous page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005.md?page=2) [Next page](https://www.trainerroad.com/forum/t/2023-specialized-allez/84005.md?page=4)